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Independence Day?

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  • punkdocpunkdoc Posts: 15,039

    Completely agree Obelixx.

    The defeatist attitude is understandable, people are waking up to the terrible mistake they have made.

    How can you lie there and think of England
    When you don't even know who's in the team

    S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
  • KT53KT53 Posts: 9,016
    obelixx says:
    France, will want to punish so as not to encourage their own dissidents and separatists.

    For those who worry about excess immigration the UK has skills shortages Last edited: 30 June 2016 14:55:12

    See original post

     Would this the the same France who's finance minister has today said there would be no red lines in talks over the single market?  Doesn't sound much like a desire to punish the UK to me.

    I've yet to speak to anybody who has a problem with skilled workers coming to the UK.  What many people have a problem with is the open door policy to anybody who wants to come here and then not contribute to the economy.

  • punkdocpunkdoc Posts: 15,039

    We have a far bigger problem with Brits. who don't contribute to the economy, than we do with immigrants.

    We get more from them in taxes than they cost us.

    How can you lie there and think of England
    When you don't even know who's in the team

    S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
  • ObelixxObelixx Posts: 30,087

    D Riley - The French demanded Strasbourg as a concession after they realised they'd made a huge economic boo-boo in refusing to have the fledgling EU commission based in Paris all those years ago.  Brussels has seen its ecomomy soar on the back of all those lovely eurocrats, MEPs, international companies setting up HQs, the lobbyists and, of course, service providers to house, feed, clothe, maintain and entertain them.  

    A sensible coalition of the other EU partners would have quashed it but the other countries tend to see themselves as too small or too new to stand up to France and Germany and the UK has never really engaged with the EU, behaving as though as it was us and them instead of working with the others to limit Franco-German power posturing.   These two are jointly so paranoid about,on the one hand starting another conflict and on the other, being beaten again, that they have blindly pushed for ever closer political unity and lost sight of local, regional and national fears about loss of identity and control.   In addition, France is naturally Socialist and wary of capitalism and doesn't understand that peace is best assured by economic prosperity and stability.   It has more people employed by the state than by businesses creating money.   That's why the EU is no longer just an economic union.

    What is clear now is that the UK no longer has any say in how the EU evolves economically or politically so best to stop beefing and get on with putting the UK back on an even keel.

    Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
    "The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
    Plato
  • Were they all immigrants in front of you in the queue at A & E, D Riley ? 

    It'll be OK in A & E, though, after the £350 million per week gets in to the NHS, ( the promise on the bus ) when does it start ?

    Next week, month ?

  • YviestevieYviestevie Posts: 7,066

    I've spent a great deal of time in A&E and hospital over the last few years.

    A non English Surgeon carried out a quadruple bypass on my husband

    A non english Surgeon repaired my Grandaughters broken elbow

    A non English Surgeon reattached my husbands retina and gave him his sight back.

    Many non English carers help look after my 94 year old mother.

    Most of my family work in the NHS and public services so I have a great perspective on the NHS.  Thank god for all those 'immigrants'.

    Hi from Kingswinford in the West Midlands
  • YviestevieYviestevie Posts: 7,066

    I tell you what Richard, I bet DR's wait would have been a lot longer if it hadn't been for all the 'immigrants' who work in the NHS.

    Hi from Kingswinford in the West Midlands
  • ObelixxObelixx Posts: 30,087

    How many of the nurses and doctors and orderlies were from the EU?

    That mythical 350 million also has to replace all the structural investment in Cornwall and Wales and the funds the EU had allocated for Yorkshire and science and research across the UK.   There's some interesting info here http://ec.europa.eu/budget/mycountry/UK/index_en.cfm which you may, or may not choose to believe.   I reckon it's more reliable than Farage or Boris or Gove. 

    Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
    "The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
    Plato
  • KT53KT53 Posts: 9,016
    punkdoc says:

    We have a far bigger problem with Brits. who don't contribute to the economy, than we do with immigrants.

    We get more from them in taxes than they cost us.

    See original post

     I don't dispute that we have a problem with Brits who don't contribute to the economy, but allowing others in to add to the problem isn't helpful.  More should have been done years ago to stop the UK's own workshy from claiming benefits.  There are many who could and should work but don't.

    When I worked for DWP I had claim forms come across my desk where the questions about previous employment had a line through them and a response of "Never worked"!  These from people in their 30's and 40's with a lifetime of claiming JSA, then onto ESA, moving back to JSA just before they would be required to attend a medical then repeating the process time and time again. 

    The "We get more from them in taxes than they cost us" argument is spurious.  We may well do over time, but even those in work require housing, medical support, schooling for children etc. and that can't happen overnight.  Structured, controlled immigration is what virtually every major economy outside the EU has.  It's simple common sense.

  • YviestevieYviestevie Posts: 7,066

    Im not daft and I'm not a bad loser.  I just get angry when I hear people blaming immigrants for the state of the country.  The reason our Education, Housing and NHS services are in such a mess is that they have been underfunded for years, I for one would happily pay more taxes for properly funded services and I'm sure many of the immigrants who work in this country would too.

    Hi from Kingswinford in the West Midlands
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