The bureaucrats live here HCF! They are seconded on 3 year rolling rotas like diplomats on foreign service. Some stay here all their professional lives. Boris Johnson went to Eton thanks to his dad being seconded to the EU! There are EU schools here too but some prefer to send their kid sto boarding school or BSB, the British school of Brussels. They get their houses and schools paid for and lots of other perks but there are, proportionally, as many Brits as any other nationality and all working the system for themselves and their career as much as for their home country.
It's not just EU bureaucrats that make daft rules. How many daft ones does the UK parliament invent each year? or your local council?
The main problem as I see it is a lack of information in the UK about how much good the EU does and also about what is available to the UK from EU finances and systems. Too many see it is as a block rather than an opportunity. It is easier to influence for the good from the inside than it is just peering through a thickly glazed window or a keyhole and wishing.
Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
"The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
I'm 'in'. It's not perfect, but I really believe we're 'stronger together'.
I think that TTIP is actually the biggest threat to our way of life in the UK and in the EU, but hardly anyone has heard of it (Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership).
It stops our governments taking action that might harm corporate profits - for example, if it was discovered that 'Bob's Mighty Kill' weedkiller was causing cancer, the EU/UK might take action to ban it. But Bob Inc. who manufacturers said weedkiller could sue the government for harming their sales.
It sounds far-fetched, but various tobacco manufacturers have used similar actions against countries that bring in tobacco-control measures. Search for 'Last Week Tonight with John Oliver: Tobacco (HBO)' on YouTube.
When Dave and his mates have sold off the NHS and education, it'll stop any future governments reversing it.
I thought the MEPs spent some time in Strasbourg - or did they actually carry out the proposal to scrap that Obs? Cheers! Ma.
p.s. does it really matter which school people went to? My OH went to Harrow - because his parents owned a couple of shops............................!
As a gardener I don't feel I am overly concerned one way or the other, although I do order plants from the Continent, but I could live without that..
...otherwise, I am In one day, and Out the next...which makes Abstention seem an attractive proposition..
... there are times I'd like to see Juncker proved wrong, he seems to think he knows us better than we know ourselves, and he may be right...he probably is.. but I disagree with an earlier post that claims we are closer culturally with Europe... I think we have always been closer to English speaking countries around the world... it's known as the 'Anglosphere'... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglosphere
...although I have a strong admiration for some Eastern countries like Poland and apart from language I don't see them as too distant... I have part Polish ancestry myself...and where would we be here without all the migrant workers? and most of them do work, and very hard too, contrary to popular belief...
..I find the E.U. to be a huge monolithic blunderbus, but it serves to keep everyone, including us, in check... but two things that I ponder...
...As an older person, if I voted Out, will I be infringing on the lives of younger people, who may need the E.U. more than I do in the future? Economically, and for social and security reasons, it may be more beneficial to them..
...Then I consider those who have gone before and fought and died in the most horrendous circumstances, years of warfare for what?... so we can all be bullied by whoever is the latest German Chancellor?
...for they will always be the one with the greatest say, the one who leads and the rest have to follow... this has been made abundantly clear in recent months, if it wasn't before...
...I've always been a strong supporter of both the E.U. and Angela Merkel, anything else was unthinkable until recently when I have been moved in the opposite direction and disapprove of her unilateral decisions and then expect everyone else to gather around and support them... I think it's frightening...
...perhaps those who have fought and died would want to see a united Europe, and my instinct is still to Remain, but if we do vote for that, how can anyone ever look Remembrance day in the eye, ever again...
My father lost his brother over Germany in WW2, and nearly gave his own life. He believed firmly in the EU - on the basis that we are unlikely to go to war with countries with whom we share our financial future.
I don't think I could look Remembrance Day in the face again if I voted against remaining in the EU and for an isolationist future.
Gardening in Central Norfolk on improved gritty moraine over chalk ... free-draining.
You need to make your own decision, doesn't matter what you think of the persons promoting in or out. Heard one woman comedian saying "George Osborne wants to stay, I will vote to leave, hang on , Michael Gove wants to leave, I am being torn apart". I don't accept the argument that one way is good for Britain and one way bad. If we leave some people will be worse off and some people will be better off. In all change there are winners and losers. I do agree with Nicola Sturgeon that the remain in the EU group are playing a far too negative campaign trying to frighten people, it make it seem as if there is little positive to say about the EU.
HFC - an MEP is not one of the bureaucrats making the rules and decisions tho they do now have more power to vote on stuff than they did before. Great waste of space and time that parliament in Strasbourg and huge fiddles and wastes on housing them all and moving them up and down the railway and motorway once a month.
They also have a trail of interpreters and bureaucrats paid for bu us and all the lobbyists that have to accompany them on top of all the ones permanently in Brussels. They'd have been in Paris but, in the early days of the EEC, the French missed a trick and said they didn't want it so Belgium got it, along with European NATO hq and SHAPE.
Britain has 3 embassies here - to Belgium, EU and NATO........... plus a consulate.
Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
"The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
I voted for in last time and then watched with dismay as our national interests were eaten away. Yes if you join a club then obey the rules though watching others drive tractors through the rules whilst we blindly obeyed stuck in my throat. If we can keep some of our own national traits then it is yes. If Continental farmers continue to flout the rules that are driving our farmers to the wall then it is out. This is not about illegal imigration we have had that since 1066 and before it is about losing our Britishness, it will be make my mind up day when I go to vote and will read watch and study it all well in the meantime.
Posts
Not saying it's (per se) Belgium's fault, Obs - just that the bureaucrats seem to spend most of their time there!
I think Dave M has made some very good points - wish there were a "like" button here!
The bureaucrats live here HCF! They are seconded on 3 year rolling rotas like diplomats on foreign service. Some stay here all their professional lives. Boris Johnson went to Eton thanks to his dad being seconded to the EU! There are EU schools here too but some prefer to send their kid sto boarding school or BSB, the British school of Brussels. They get their houses and schools paid for and lots of other perks but there are, proportionally, as many Brits as any other nationality and all working the system for themselves and their career as much as for their home country.
It's not just EU bureaucrats that make daft rules. How many daft ones does the UK parliament invent each year? or your local council?
The main problem as I see it is a lack of information in the UK about how much good the EU does and also about what is available to the UK from EU finances and systems. Too many see it is as a block rather than an opportunity. It is easier to influence for the good from the inside than it is just peering through a thickly glazed window or a keyhole and wishing.
I'm 'in'. It's not perfect, but I really believe we're 'stronger together'.
I think that TTIP is actually the biggest threat to our way of life in the UK and in the EU, but hardly anyone has heard of it (Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership).
It stops our governments taking action that might harm corporate profits - for example, if it was discovered that 'Bob's Mighty Kill' weedkiller was causing cancer, the EU/UK might take action to ban it. But Bob Inc. who manufacturers said weedkiller could sue the government for harming their sales.
It sounds far-fetched, but various tobacco manufacturers have used similar actions against countries that bring in tobacco-control measures. Search for 'Last Week Tonight with John Oliver: Tobacco (HBO)' on YouTube.
When Dave and his mates have sold off the NHS and education, it'll stop any future governments reversing it.
I thought the MEPs spent some time in Strasbourg - or did they actually carry out the proposal to scrap that Obs? Cheers! Ma.
p.s. does it really matter which school people went to? My OH went to Harrow - because his parents owned a couple of shops............................!
As a gardener I don't feel I am overly concerned one way or the other, although I do order plants from the Continent, but I could live without that..
...otherwise, I am In one day, and Out the next...which makes Abstention seem an attractive proposition..
... there are times I'd like to see Juncker proved wrong, he seems to think he knows us better than we know ourselves, and he may be right...he probably is.. but I disagree with an earlier post that claims we are closer culturally with Europe... I think we have always been closer to English speaking countries around the world... it's known as the 'Anglosphere'...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglosphere
...although I have a strong admiration for some Eastern countries like Poland and apart from language I don't see them as too distant... I have part Polish ancestry myself...and where would we be here without all the migrant workers? and most of them do work, and very hard too, contrary to popular belief...
..I find the E.U. to be a huge monolithic blunderbus, but it serves to keep everyone, including us, in check... but two things that I ponder...
...As an older person, if I voted Out, will I be infringing on the lives of younger people, who may need the E.U. more than I do in the future? Economically, and for social and security reasons, it may be more beneficial to them..
...Then I consider those who have gone before and fought and died in the most horrendous circumstances, years of warfare for what?... so we can all be bullied by whoever is the latest German Chancellor?
...for they will always be the one with the greatest say, the one who leads and the rest have to follow... this has been made abundantly clear in recent months, if it wasn't before...
...I've always been a strong supporter of both the E.U. and Angela Merkel, anything else was unthinkable until recently when I have been moved in the opposite direction and disapprove of her unilateral decisions and then expect everyone else to gather around and support them... I think it's frightening...
...perhaps those who have fought and died would want to see a united Europe, and my instinct is still to Remain, but if we do vote for that, how can anyone ever look Remembrance day in the eye, ever again...
My father lost his brother over Germany in WW2, and nearly gave his own life. He believed firmly in the EU - on the basis that we are unlikely to go to war with countries with whom we share our financial future.
I don't think I could look Remembrance Day in the face again if I voted against remaining in the EU and for an isolationist future.
Gardening in Central Norfolk on improved gritty moraine over chalk ... free-draining.
You need to make your own decision, doesn't matter what you think of the persons promoting in or out. Heard one woman comedian saying "George Osborne wants to stay, I will vote to leave, hang on , Michael Gove wants to leave, I am being torn apart". I don't accept the argument that one way is good for Britain and one way bad. If we leave some people will be worse off and some people will be better off. In all change there are winners and losers. I do agree with Nicola Sturgeon that the remain in the EU group are playing a far too negative campaign trying to frighten people, it make it seem as if there is little positive to say about the EU.
HFC - an MEP is not one of the bureaucrats making the rules and decisions tho they do now have more power to vote on stuff than they did before. Great waste of space and time that parliament in Strasbourg and huge fiddles and wastes on housing them all and moving them up and down the railway and motorway once a month.
They also have a trail of interpreters and bureaucrats paid for bu us and all the lobbyists that have to accompany them on top of all the ones permanently in Brussels. They'd have been in Paris but, in the early days of the EEC, the French missed a trick and said they didn't want it so Belgium got it, along with European NATO hq and SHAPE.
Britain has 3 embassies here - to Belgium, EU and NATO........... plus a consulate.
I voted for in last time and then watched with dismay as our national interests were eaten away. Yes if you join a club then obey the rules though watching others drive tractors through the rules whilst we blindly obeyed stuck in my throat. If we can keep some of our own national traits then it is yes. If Continental farmers continue to flout the rules that are driving our farmers to the wall then it is out. This is not about illegal imigration we have had that since 1066 and before it is about losing our Britishness, it will be make my mind up day when I go to vote and will read watch and study it all well in the meantime.
Frank