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  • punkdocpunkdoc Posts: 15,039
    edited September 2023
    Nature versus nurture is an argument that has raged for generations, but I think in recent years scientists have realised that genetics does not work alone very often, if ever.
    Epigenetics is the science behind how genes only do what they do, because of the environment they are in.
    This means that the nature versus nurture debate should be put to bed.
    How can you lie there and think of England
    When you don't even know who's in the team

    S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
  • steveTusteveTu Posts: 3,219
    Would anyone have thought that traits were genetic and passed on 300 years ago? They may have guessed. What will be known in 300 years? Man (shaun) is 2 million years old (as far as we know) and genes and DNA were discovered by humans when?
    Can you ever quote science as though we're at the pinnacle? Shouldn't all scientific explanations be caveated by '...from what we know now...'?
    '...on the shoulders of giants...' means exactly that.

    If breeding has no effect on temperament, then why breed 'docile' animals - isn't that what was done with domestication? Isn't a dog bred (in general) to be more docile than a wolf?
    UK - South Coast Retirement Campus (East)
  • punkdocpunkdoc Posts: 15,039
    However much we try to influence the genetics of a creature, the environment will still determine how those genes are expressed, so breeding for docility will not work if the environment is not appropriate.

    How can you lie there and think of England
    When you don't even know who's in the team

    S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
  • We are affected by our genes, and we are affected by external factors. If you have genes for tall then you are more likely to be tall, but if you don't get enough protein as a child then your height will be reduced. The only question is, what is the proportion of genetics to other factors for a given consequence? Epigenetics is another complication.
  • steveTusteveTu Posts: 3,219
    Is that true? Do we know what every gene and combination of genes does? Do we even have a definition of 'gene' yet?https://bmcbiol.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12915-018-0564-x

    UK - South Coast Retirement Campus (East)
  • wild edgeswild edges Posts: 10,497
    Isn't breeding for docility just putting a few generations of diluted instinct between your pet and its wild ancestor? The dog still hears the echo of the need to hunt but its belly is full and the owner suggests it herds some sheep instead. The same thing happens to small children who feel the urge to sit in trees eating fruit.
    If you can keep your head, while those around you are losing theirs, you may not have grasped the seriousness of the situation.
  • steveTusteveTu Posts: 3,219
    @wild edges ...what is diluted instinct over generations other than breeding?
    UK - South Coast Retirement Campus (East)
  • B3B3 Posts: 27,505
    I've always wondered why wood smoke in the distance (wildfires excepted of course) always smells good - an association with warmth, food and company inherited from our ancestors?
    In London. Keen but lazy.
  • punkdoc said:
    However much we try to influence the genetics of a creature, the environment will still determine how those genes are expressed, so breeding for docility will not work if the environment is not appropriate.

    How would the environment turn off a gene that increase docility?
  • punkdocpunkdoc Posts: 15,039
    It wouldn't necessarily turn off a docility gene, but may affect the activity of another gene, I suppose. There are usually multiple genes responsible for most characteristics, with much inbuilt redundancy, which I assume can become non redundant.
    How can you lie there and think of England
    When you don't even know who's in the team

    S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
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