'...aren’t you over complicating the discussion of getting a voter ID card from the local council?,,,'
Don't think so! If someone proposes a system to stop fraud that is itself blatantly open to fraud then I think there's an issue. As why then introduce it in the first place? But I can't find much so far on how the free local IDs will be issued, so my concerns may be closed off when 'the system' is implemented.
It doesn't affect me, as I have a passport - but that in itself is an insane comment - as that might not stop someone else applying for a card fraudulently in my name anyway.
And as for somebody applying for a card in your name, when the second vote is logged against your name by the polling station officers and the police notified, it won’t take PC 41 much time in ascertaining who is the genuine voter and who is not. The person who answers the door when the doorbell rings will be a big clue!
OK, explain how the photo is authenticated to the name.
As for your second paragraph - I record my photo on the address at blah with name blah blah. I still vote. How does PC 41 catch me again? PC 41 goes to the address and see the true named person, not the photo'd one doesn't he? He doesn't go to the fraudsters address (which no one knows). The PC never sees the fraudsters photo. How can the PC tell who voted? And as I said before, the problem with security is that it ends up coming down to you to prove who you are. See any reports of ID fraud and see how difficult it was for the 'real' person to sort it out - as the whole point of ID is that it's secure.
I speak from limited experience here, as where I live has a similar address 2 miles away - and I've had debt collectors, banks and goodness knows who else chasing me here, even though the person they looked for had a different name. I even called banks in the past and told them they had the wrong address, and was told unless I was the account holder, I couldn't change the address and neither could they (even though they were in breach of data protection as it's up to the company to ensure the veracity of their data).
I'm for ID cards, but ID cards are then not a joke - they need the strictest procedures in setting them up and defining the procedures and processes around them.
Quite, B3. It's all fine as long as no one is wearing a tin foil hat but they're fairly easy to spot, as a rule.
I imagine the ID card will have a photo, your name and a bar code. To access the information apart from the name, you'd need a scanner and access to the database, which is entirely feasible, of course but probably not as generally scammable as a cheque book.
I've signed a few photos for passports. I haven't signed them for people I didn't know and the photo was always certainly of the person applying. This relies on the general honesty of the population and most people are honest, most people would understand the seriousness of signing fraudulently and GPs and solicitors are as susceptible to bribery if they are not honest as anyone else, so that really hasn't changed. The difference now is social media and the internet generally. I'm careful to avoid having my photo on the net, but even so, there are dozens of pictures of me that Google will show you if you ask for me by name, associated with work stuff. That resource wasn't available to the authorities until quite recently but these days, anyone who doesn't have a picture either on record from previous passports or on line sitting next to a glass of wine with a sunset in the background will probably attract the interest of MI5 as highly suspicious
Gardening on the edge of Exmoor, in Devon
“It's still magic even if you know how it's done.”
'...This relies on the general honesty of the population and most people are honest..'
But I'm missing it here. The whole point of the suggested voter ID card is because of the opposite. Because some people are fraudulently voting - allegedly. So if you introduce something to stop that fraud, it itself should not be open to the same sort of fraud should it? Or else what is the point? Fraudsters by their very title aren't honest.
It will be interesting to see what the Gov implements with regard to the voter card. But by then, if the authentication procedures are flaky, it's a bit late eh? That should be of primary importance now.
It took me over six months to sort out someone who had simply used my address - as 'data protection' stopped me accessing my data (ie my address) that had been registered in someone else's name. Contact with the ICO - and data control at a very large financial institution was a joke - as I had to prove that I was who I said I was and that my data had been misused first. Frustratingly, the financial institution had then passed my address (and phone number) to third parties - and I never got to the bottom of whether my address or phone number appeared on any third party black lists or credit reports.
@raisingirl, I’ve just done a Google image search of my real name and no photos of me appeared although, high up the rankings, were a pair of pliers and Rishi Sunak.
Then I did an image search for Ben Cotto and discovered lots of restaurants are named after me. That’s nice.
I think there's a few ppl on here out to look for issues that won't be there after implementation. As to what the implementation is we do not know and I doubt we'll find out the whole of it neither for security reasons.
FWIW medical data won't be on the card, it does need to be because once an ID card is used to prove who you are another system called medical records kick in. Those would or are on another system with its own security. You've probably taken advantage of that system already.
Right now your photo ID driving licence and passport can use the same verified photo. Any other system could easily piggyback on that for photo verification.
One group of professionals who could always verify photos was company directors. There's code and laws covering their behaviour in business but do they carry over into photo verification? Same with other professionals. There may well be fraud laws covering verification which would apply to anyone doing the verification. That's possibly why it's opened up to anyone who knows you. Whatever b the case, once your photo has been verified its able to be used for n any photo ID card.
I think there's too many sceptics looking for reasons not to get an ID system even if it's making up problems which have been solved in current systems actually in place.
Posts
And as for somebody applying for a card in your name, when the second vote is logged against your name by the polling station officers and the police notified, it won’t take PC 41 much time in ascertaining who is the genuine voter and who is not. The person who answers the door when the doorbell rings will be a big clue!
When you don't even know who's in the team
S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
I imagine the ID card will have a photo, your name and a bar code. To access the information apart from the name, you'd need a scanner and access to the database, which is entirely feasible, of course but probably not as generally scammable as a cheque book.
I've signed a few photos for passports. I haven't signed them for people I didn't know and the photo was always certainly of the person applying. This relies on the general honesty of the population and most people are honest, most people would understand the seriousness of signing fraudulently and GPs and solicitors are as susceptible to bribery if they are not honest as anyone else, so that really hasn't changed. The difference now is social media and the internet generally. I'm careful to avoid having my photo on the net, but even so, there are dozens of pictures of me that Google will show you if you ask for me by name, associated with work stuff. That resource wasn't available to the authorities until quite recently but these days, anyone who doesn't have a picture either on record from previous passports or on line sitting next to a glass of wine with a sunset in the background will probably attract the interest of MI5 as highly suspicious
“It's still magic even if you know how it's done.”
Then I did an image search for Ben Cotto and discovered lots of restaurants are named after me. That’s nice.
“It's still magic even if you know how it's done.”
FWIW medical data won't be on the card, it does need to be because once an ID card is used to prove who you are another system called medical records kick in. Those would or are on another system with its own security. You've probably taken advantage of that system already.
Right now your photo ID driving licence and passport can use the same verified photo. Any other system could easily piggyback on that for photo verification.
One group of professionals who could always verify photos was company directors. There's code and laws covering their behaviour in business but do they carry over into photo verification? Same with other professionals. There may well be fraud laws covering verification which would apply to anyone doing the verification. That's possibly why it's opened up to anyone who knows you. Whatever b the case, once your photo has been verified its able to be used for n any photo ID card.
I think there's too many sceptics looking for reasons not to get an ID system even if it's making up problems which have been solved in current systems actually in place.