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Big Garden Birdwatch 28-30 January 2022

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  • purplerallimpurplerallim Posts: 5,287
    The count was more representative when I first started doing it, this was before they started harking on about only an hour counting.
    As you say it's bad science @Fairygirl as they will now think I have no Starlings, whereas in fact up to 20 can come into my garden. 
    Bad weather, noise,  or a raptor could make birds that usually come every day stay away, and that means the compilation of data is faulty. 
    So are the "in danger" birds really that, or was there just a cat about.
    When you see the professionals drift netting on the coast, they do it for weeks not just an hour.
  • TheGreenManTheGreenMan Posts: 1,957
    I was thinking it was a dodgy way of doing it. 

    They might argue that someone ten doors down might count the birds I don’t and vice versa. I think it should be any birds you can see from where you are and over the course of the day. But what do I know? 
  • While waiting for the floor to dry I sat in the conservatory watching the birds, and as usual lots of birds around. Then I see the Wren sat on my bench, and next Robbie appears to have a girlfriend 🙄 it happens every year straight after the count, all I need is a flock of Starlings and my count is trashed.🤣
  • I'm a bit jealous of the variety some of you get. We see the odd blue tit, gold finch, wren in the winter but apart from that it's sparrows, blackbirds and a Robin. My count was 20 sparrows and a pair of blackbirds.
    In summer we did have wrens, blackbirds, great tit,  gold finches and a pair of wood pigeons all next in our back garden, which was nice.    
  • punkdocpunkdoc Posts: 15,039
    I am surprised that people think it is not good science.
    It is the largest piece of citizen science ever conducted and has been running for 40 years.
    Of course it will not tell you about non garden birds, I don't see any wigeon in the garden, but there are hundreds half a mile down the road.
    To be useful the time scale has to be something that people can commit to, which is why an hour is chosen.
    What it does do, is to show trends, which are backed up by other studies conducted by the BTO for example.
    It is the shear size that makes it so valuable.
    How can you lie there and think of England
    When you don't even know who's in the team

    S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
  • wild edgeswild edges Posts: 10,497
    I think the problem is the parameters are never fully explained to people. I've seen queries about the logic behind the study all over the place but no one ever has a definitive answer. Is the hour time-frame chosen because that is the limit of the attention span for the average person, because science works best within fixed parameters or to limit the overlap of birds counted between local gardens? Probably a bit of all three but it would be good for them to explain it a bit. The best we get is:
    We also get asked about things like weather and food but because the results are based on information from so many people doing the Birdwatch the effects of weather, food and time all even themselves out – incredible isn’t it!




    If you can keep your head, while those around you are losing theirs, you may not have grasped the seriousness of the situation.
  • LunarSeaLunarSea Posts: 1,923
    punkdoc said:
    I am surprised that people think it is not good science.


    I'm surprised that you think it is. What is scientific about obtaining lists from people that are obviously not representative of the norm, extrapolating those up for the whole country and then drawing totally misleading, and often alarmist, conclusions from them.
    Clay soil - Cheshire/Derbyshire border

    I play with plants and soil and sometimes it's successful

  • wild edgeswild edges Posts: 10,497
    A million people joined in on the survey last year. Explain how that kind of data could be recorded using regular scientific methods? The conclusions we see published are just the broad trends of annual bird health but the data is used elsewhere for various purposes including informing government policy.
    If you can keep your head, while those around you are losing theirs, you may not have grasped the seriousness of the situation.
  • punkdocpunkdoc Posts: 15,039
    As @wild edges says, I think it is brilliant science. Most science is about observation, and a million people looking all over the country provides a huge amount of information.
    Yesterday I had a tree creeper in the garden, would study be better if I had included that, knowing that I see one every few weeks?
    If the 20 starlings which are normally in your garden at 11.00 am were not there, they were probably in someone else garden. The huge numbers of people make it valuable.

    On a separate theme, the study appears to have made far more people interested in their wildlife and therefore likely to try and help it.
    How can you lie there and think of England
    When you don't even know who's in the team

    S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
  • LunarSeaLunarSea Posts: 1,923
    punkdoc said:

    If the 20 starlings which are normally in your garden at 11.00 am were not there, they were probably in someone else garden.

    I would hope that the RSPB would not derive any conclusions regarding Starling populations from the Garden Birdwatch. They feed mainly in the fields, in large flocks, not gardens. Occasionally they will find significant populations of leatherjackets in a garden and will exploit them but more often than not they find a more reliable food source in farm fields.

    As I mentioned previously we have a roost of 50+ Starlings each night in our Laurel trees but I recorded just one in the garden during my hour. So which is the most useful count?

    A million people joined in on the survey last year. Explain how that kind of data could be recorded using regular scientific methods? 

    Citizen science operates in many ways. There are many of us regular birdwatchers who submit all our sightings, garden or otherwise, all year round through our county bird recorder. Some of us also use a system called BirdTrack to record our bird lists directly. We also contribute to breeding bird surveys, wetland bird study counts and other one-off studies. Yes the Garden Birdwatch is useful but I feel these other methods provide far more accurate data on our bird populations than what happens to be in our garden during one hour on one day.

    Clay soil - Cheshire/Derbyshire border

    I play with plants and soil and sometimes it's successful

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