Lawn in shady area with poor drainage?
Superhero
Posts: 53
Hi there
I've recently moved house and although the garden is south facing, there are big old oak trees adjacent to our fence that seem to block out a lot of light (which is such a shame as I will have to find a solution for growing veg...). The previous owner said she had troubles growing grass in the back area especially and had the oak overhang cut (but there is still too much of the trees for my liking and gardening needs). The next door neighbours had artifical turf laid because they, too, couldn't grow grass successfully.
It's hard to say at this stage and in this season whether the area is of poor drainage indeed but it is very very soggy out there at the moment indeed, and with the shade from the trees I do suspect this to be the case.
I know there are seed mixes and rolled turf for shady areas especially but would they also survive with poor drainage? Is there anything I could/should do when preparing the surface and is ready grown turf (the rolled variety) preferable to seed mixes in this case or not?
Or should I save myself the money and go artificial???
Posts
if its shady and has poor drainage you're wasting your time trying to grow grass.
you can improve the drainage, but with two big oak trees shading the area even then grass will struggle, fake grass has got better in the past few years (but still looks a bit naff)
what about not having grass? hard standing with planting pockets, gravel, more beds?
How can I check the drainage? By digging a hole and adding water, seeing how quickly it will drain?
Is there a way to improve drainage without digging it up too much?
I've always hated artificial grass, I just really love grass, the smell, feel and look of it. I do agree though, that it's gotten much better lately and it does become more attractive. It's funny though, one thing I hate most about it is the way falled leaves just "sit" on top of it, instead of "sink in" like they would with natural grass. That's something that gives it away for me.
I just love nature and although the clean non-mud aspect of artifical lawn is very attractive to me, I wonder if I'd feel like I'd be living in a plastic barbie world when enjoying the garden in summer.
I have also been thinking about gravel, especially since it's not a massive garden once we've added a big shed/summer house, but I still do prefer the soft feel of grass. I love walking on it barefoot in summer and there is just something "soothing" and "calming" about it rather than harsh gravel.
You could get a tree surgeon to raise the canopy of the oaks and let in more light and build raised beds for veggies so they have good drainage.
However, if you want a grass lawn you are going to have to tackle the drainage problem and that involves digging out a lot of soil, making a soakaway or installing a land drain and then putting back the soil. If you can get in there with a mini digger you can cut the time involved.
Dig a trial hole and fill it with water and then see how long it takes to drain. If it doesn't, you have a serrious problem to fix. If it does, but slowly, maybe try planting some ornamental willows to soak up water. They can be coppiced to keep the stem colour and control size.
If you do opt for gravel, buy it from a builders' merchant rather than garden centre to get a better price and make sure you use a fork to make deep holes in the soil then brush in sharp sand to help with drainage and then apply a good quality sheet of porous membrane to stop the gravel sinking into the soil.
Thanks for all the advice!
The previous owner said that it was a bit of a struggle to get permission to have the trees cut as they are so old and they are on a neighouring property, but I don't know who actually owns it. So I believe that's why she's just had one or two branches cut, the ones that were covering the garden most.
I have to say that I don't know if the previous owner or the neighbours tried to use a lawn mix especially made for shade - I don't assume they did. So this might be something relatively easy and cheap to try.
I will do the drainage test first though.
And the willow solution sounds interesting!
if you dig a hole (1 foot x 1 foot x 1 foot), fill it to the top with water and once its drained fully fill it to the top again and see how long it takes to drain away, that way you're testing drainage rather than seepage. if it takes more than 2 hours for the second water fill water level to drop an inch then you have bad drainage.
if the trees aren't yours you can only touch the bits overhanging your property, also you need to check to see if they have a TPO ( tree protection order) on them - your local council will know. If they do you can't touch them with getting prior consent otherwise you get a large fine.
I believe they do have a TPO which is why the previous owner had so much trouble getting the trimmed in the first place
How big is the lawn going to be, how big is the garden? Lawns can be any shape or size square oblong round or serpentine. Sit and note what parts get some sun and how long it cannot all be in shade all day. The trees will soak up a lot of water, it is often arid under a tree and that kills the grass.
Could you make a serpentine grass path leading to open areas of say round patches of lawn, lets face it if you sit out it will be the warmest part of the garden. A grass path with slightly raised edging to retain the extra soil and then the turf, this would allow it to be raised above water level a bit and good turf would help. Your vegetables could also be in raised beds or pots would be enough for a family. It needs to be studied and planned, do it once the right way, saves a lot a back ache later. We gardeners have to make the best of what we have and usually succeed though a garden is never finished.
Frank.
Okay so I've been doing some research/digging. I dug three holes in different areas. Please have a look at the photos.
Underneath the turf we have clay/loam. Near the house we also have builders rubbish and rubble, under one hole is concrete, probably some leftovers. There is a lot of sand and grit too which i could dig into the clay. (PIC 1)
In the back (pic2) it's a bit different but still no good. I dug as deep as a spade, 20cm or so and then the earth became darker. Would i need to dig much deeper than this?
Question is: am i better off getting a tiller and turning it all over or should i try to just sow some lawn seed?
I should add that the lawn in the back, pic2, is under some big oak trees (which can't be pruned any more as they are protected), so would I actually be better off NOT to dig this soil over as the loam might actually help keep the grass moist while the roots of the tree drink up all the water underneath?
Do you have to have a lawn there?
one side of my house is lined with oak trees. All over 150 years old with tpo's so they will still be there long after I am gone. I have given up on grass on that side of the garden. The previous owners of our house put in a woodland/japonica garden. It is a mix things which are happy to grow in the shady damp conditions there which I am now enlarging to lose the rest of the grass there as it was more moss than grass. The front garden section I am having block paved As no matter what I have tried over the last few years nothing works. Different types of grass seed, feeding it, cutting and keeping it very short or leaving longer. It just dies and moss grows in its place.