Trying hard to keep out of any acrimonious debate but . . . . when was Turkey in Europe? Istanbul = yes. The bulk of the country = no (or so I was taught in Geography many moons ago). So do we want a non-European country to be guaranteed full rights in the EU? Is the geographical closeness to areas of Middle East conflict in our best interests? And is the cultural divide too much for long-term assimilation? I worry about the future.
The voting date gets closer. I still have to make up my mind. I don't have any facts from fractious politicians.
I am not going to join in again, as it is clear trouble is just around the corner. BUT, please get your facts right, Turkey has NOT been promised EU membership, and the money is for taking refugees.
How can you lie there and think of England When you don't even know who's in the team
No-one said that Turkey had been promised full EU membership - but it is what they are aiming for - and much of the appeasement from the EU in general, and Germany in particular, realises that some sort of deal has to be done to try to control the refugee/immigrant problem. Thus far there seems to have been some success when looking at numbers. Whether or not it is a long-term solution is another matter. And whether or not extending the EU borders is in everyone's interests is yet another debate. I worry about the future: short-term political expediency is not necessarily an appropriate solution imo.
Like Shrinking Violet I have welcomed the sharing of views. In my town I have found people uninterested/uniformed about the referendum and so it is good to hear other’s views.
I wonder if it is because I live in a rural area that people here feel it doesn’t affect them. For the first time in my life I am glad I was born when I was, but with the referendum I feel full responsibility to be informed so that I can vote appropriately for the generations following. The juggernaut of constant building locally – ‘we need more houses’ they say but young locals can’t afford them. Deals going on with councils upcountry (allegedly) to make the area more multicultural. The only jobs advertised in this area seem to be in care. So where will all these people from the thousands of new houses work? The roads have not been improved or widened, there are no new schools, GP surgeries, dentist etc. Some local hospital services are being removed – they are being moved away to a bigger town one hour away. Eventually the locals will feel affected.
How do we fund benefits for so many incomers? Assimilation – I lived and worked abroad in several different countries. I applied for residence permit, work permit (there were no benefits) and I learned the language and customs. If we had control over immigration maybe there would be more assimilation?
So discussion is good, I hope that people will feel the responsibility to fully inform themselves about the issues around Brexit. Whichever way the vote goes, things will not remain the same.
AlexX - I see you are in North Devon. I am in Mid Devon. So both of us are in rural areas, sufficiently distant from the problems in the south east. But many people see problems around the corner - you refer to housing, and infrastructure, and those are clear concerns. I am aware of a certain amount of burying of heads in the sand because we are so distant from the Westminster Village. But I hope that people are sufficiently engaged with the future to try to make some sense of the issues posed, and that whatever the outcome after the referendum, we can move forward in a positive way.
For my part, I think I worry even more about the prospect of an American President - arguably the most influential person on the planet - being a rich loudmouth (not to mention a funny hairdo LOL)
I feel real concern when hear people here talk - it's harsh to say 'not interested' but very much 'doesn't affect us'. North Devon has been fairly isolated but no longer. It has changed a lot in the last 20 years - so many supermarkets and housing estates. I admit that when I am able, I will be moving away - despite my Devon roots.
Pansyface, I totally agree that immigration is - and has been - a hugely necessary part of life in Britain, going back as far as the history records do, not to mention an enormously positive thing. Is there anything as '100% British'? I very much doubt it.
My mother and her family came to England in the 1960's from Ireland. I know how much discrimination and negativity they had to deal with, particularly going forward into the 1970's and being Irish in Birmingham. Not pleasant for an innocent family who want to work and pay their own way.
And yes, on the other side of the coin, I appreciate fully that Britain faces a population boom and a housing crisis, and yes, I believe that there should be some controls on immigration - as just ONE of the ways to deal with this. Frankly I can't stand the scaremongering that the tabloid press put about when it comes to 'bloody foreignors beseiging our country'. whipping up xenophobia.
But, I don't believe the government are doing what's necessary to help the areas suffering from over population in terms of social housing or amenities, no matter what the background of those living there.
Posts
Trying hard to keep out of any acrimonious debate but . . . . when was Turkey in Europe? Istanbul = yes. The bulk of the country = no (or so I was taught in Geography many moons ago). So do we want a non-European country to be guaranteed full rights in the EU? Is the geographical closeness to areas of Middle East conflict in our best interests? And is the cultural divide too much for long-term assimilation? I worry about the future.
The voting date gets closer. I still have to make up my mind. I don't have any facts from fractious politicians.
At least in an Ottoman empire you'd never be short of a comfy seat to recline on.
The best thing one should do to an Ottoman?
I am not going to join in again, as it is clear trouble is just around the corner. BUT, please get your facts right, Turkey has NOT been promised EU membership, and the money is for taking refugees.
When you don't even know who's in the team
S.Yorkshire/Derbyshire border
No-one said that Turkey had been promised full EU membership - but it is what they are aiming for - and much of the appeasement from the EU in general, and Germany in particular, realises that some sort of deal has to be done to try to control the refugee/immigrant problem. Thus far there seems to have been some success when looking at numbers. Whether or not it is a long-term solution is another matter. And whether or not extending the EU borders is in everyone's interests is yet another debate. I worry about the future: short-term political expediency is not necessarily an appropriate solution imo.
Like Shrinking Violet I have welcomed the sharing of views. In my town I have found people uninterested/uniformed about the referendum and so it is good to hear other’s views.
I wonder if it is because I live in a rural area that people here feel it doesn’t affect them. For the first time in my life I am glad I was born when I was, but with the referendum I feel full responsibility to be informed so that I can vote appropriately for the generations following. The juggernaut of constant building locally – ‘we need more houses’ they say but young locals can’t afford them. Deals going on with councils upcountry (allegedly) to make the area more multicultural. The only jobs advertised in this area seem to be in care. So where will all these people from the thousands of new houses work? The roads have not been improved or widened, there are no new schools, GP surgeries, dentist etc. Some local hospital services are being removed – they are being moved away to a bigger town one hour away. Eventually the locals will feel affected.
How do we fund benefits for so many incomers? Assimilation – I lived and worked abroad in several different countries. I applied for residence permit, work permit (there were no benefits) and I learned the language and customs. If we had control over immigration maybe there would be more assimilation?
So discussion is good, I hope that people will feel the responsibility to fully inform themselves about the issues around Brexit. Whichever way the vote goes, things will not remain the same.
AlexX - I see you are in North Devon. I am in Mid Devon. So both of us are in rural areas, sufficiently distant from the problems in the south east. But many people see problems around the corner - you refer to housing, and infrastructure, and those are clear concerns. I am aware of a certain amount of burying of heads in the sand because we are so distant from the Westminster Village. But I hope that people are sufficiently engaged with the future to try to make some sense of the issues posed, and that whatever the outcome after the referendum, we can move forward in a positive way.
For my part, I think I worry even more about the prospect of an American President - arguably the most influential person on the planet - being a rich loudmouth (not to mention a funny hairdo LOL)
S Violet, your last comment made me laugh.
I feel real concern when hear people here talk - it's harsh to say 'not interested' but very much 'doesn't affect us'. North Devon has been fairly isolated but no longer. It has changed a lot in the last 20 years - so many supermarkets and housing estates. I admit that when I am able, I will be moving away - despite my Devon roots.
Tetley, I agree Devon and Cornwall are beautiful places to live and property prices are rising. The North coast I find particularly beautiful.
I was born in New Zealand - maybe they'll take me back.
I dream of a 2 up/2 down in a small village, pocket handkerchief garden, maybe one shop and on a bus route. It'll be fun looking for it
Pansyface, I totally agree that immigration is - and has been - a hugely necessary part of life in Britain, going back as far as the history records do, not to mention an enormously positive thing. Is there anything as '100% British'? I very much doubt it.
My mother and her family came to England in the 1960's from Ireland. I know how much discrimination and negativity they had to deal with, particularly going forward into the 1970's and being Irish in Birmingham. Not pleasant for an innocent family who want to work and pay their own way.
And yes, on the other side of the coin, I appreciate fully that Britain faces a population boom and a housing crisis, and yes, I believe that there should be some controls on immigration - as just ONE of the ways to deal with this. Frankly I can't stand the scaremongering that the tabloid press put about when it comes to 'bloody foreignors beseiging our country'. whipping up xenophobia.
But, I don't believe the government are doing what's necessary to help the areas suffering from over population in terms of social housing or amenities, no matter what the background of those living there.