Sexist Tina, moi, not on your nelly, it is when I go into those places there seems to be three times as many women as men and they ask me I do not approach them. If asked I give a comprehensive answer and on more than one occasion have then had an escort round the place discussing plants, once even had coffee bought for me.
The local large GC had a very nice Polish lady who knew her plants, she also watered everything on the outside racks, the plants were always clean and looked after, in a buy out the good ones went and youngsters came on the scene. No watering properly, a quick flash with a hose pipe, no knowledge of the plants they read the labels and that is it. People ask questions do not get answers so leave and go elsewhere do you blame them. "Oh" and the coffee and cake went up to £7 so I do not bother.
Hi, Tina. The trouble is that many children (ones that I taught) arrive at playschool not knowing basic things like their colours and with few language skills, because their parents do not teach them. I taught for a long time in a quite deprived area where some parents were simply not equipped to teach thier children basic life skills. Parenting classes were available but could not make up for the deprivation the parents themselves had suffereded. I always thought that the best thing the state could do for those children would be to start them at playschool at 18 months or 2 years.
Some teachers are better than others, of course. A few aren't much good, some are excellent. The trouble is that educational decisions are made by politicians with a reputations to make, not be educationalists. Chidren who could barely read and write English had the 'right' to be taught French (and Welsh in my area). Why? Also, standards of discipline have fallen and childrewn are no longer able to concentrate for extended periods of time. Probably, this will eventually come full circle and we'll have discipine and basic skills again, but right now, things are weak in that area. It is not all bad, by any means, but basic maths and English do not get enough time and attention and they do suffer.
GG I had quite a big gap between eldest 2 children and my 'baby' (33). Even in the short time, approximately 5 years, between the eldest 2 moving onto senior school and the youngest starting, I was really taken aback at how things had changed. His teacher, who had always taken reception, knowing I was a 'lady of leisure', in that I didn't work, asked me if I would be willing to help out at PE time. No, not with the games, but to dress the 5 year olds! She wished parents would stop teaching them to read, etc, and concentrate on the basics, toilet, dressing, tying shoe laces, etc. They just stood there!
Nursery school, when mine were young, were places to socialise with other children and play. School started at 5. Oh dear, I do sound old.
If you are interested, although you probably know already, have a look at the Finnish schooling system. Seems pretty good to me and I know my soon to be guest is very proud of it.
My Wife's school had one very bad teacher and everyone knew she was bad although they could not get rid of her she was young at the time. I was talking to another ex-teacher who told me she is still there and they cannot get rid of her. We may be lucky, the schools my Grandchildren go to and have done since they were three are very good indeed. They have discipline and the teaching skills outstanding, Parents take a lot of interest and school events have to be rationed so many wish to attend. My Grandson 12 can recite times tables, I quietly set him tasks in Math which he does in quick time, probably my genes as I excelled at maths. What I am saying is all schools differ depending on area, size, quality of Heads and Teaching Staff, I think area has more influence on things as the parents set goals. I watch my Granddaughter 8 concentrate on doing something an hour at a time and people say children have a thirty second concentration level, don't believe it, I have hopes for their future which is all we can do.
Children with attentive, caring, relatively educated parents will do well virtually anywhere. Unfortunately, children don't start with a level playing field and the education system has to try to meet the needs of all of them.
Tina, I'm enjoying reading your responses. I was told that stuff about not teaching your child to read, teach 'em to tie their shoelaces. I didn't teach him to read. Unfortunately, since other mothers had taught their children to read, he was at a disadvantage for several years.He was underachieving and, as one teacher so tactfully told me, 'only average.'
In secondary school I did not sit down and revise for his exams with him, but let him find his level. The result - he did worse that the children whose mothers knew all the answers to the exam questions because they had coached their children for the exams. In short, I was a sucker. I disadvantaged my child.
That 'only average' child went to both Oxford and Cambridge but he still can't spell properly. So what should I really have done?
Here's a rant. I lost my temper today, which I seldom do. Although most people on this forum are charming and helpful, a minority think it is ok to make personal comments about other posters. You may think I should grow up. I may think you should grow up. Fine - but it is NOT OK to say so in a public forum. It is simply not OK to be personal, whether about other members of the forum or about well-known gardeners. Doing so says more about the person making the comments than about the person they attack or undermine. Everyone is vulnerable and everyone has faults. We need to be gentle with each other. I l love an argument if it is constructive and involves the cut and thrust of IDEAS. I also love a joke if it is without malice. Anything else is both ill-mannered and stupid. it is undignified and it causes hurt and provokes quarrels.
Hi GG, First I am very glad that you have decided to continue to post, I don't think you could have put it any better Age and Life experience speak volumes against those who have no Tolerance for another persons opinion ,I have an early start tomorrow , goodnight
I sympathise GG. Am a refugee from 'The Garden Shed' Beeb forum and, apart from the odd troll/grid, always found posters pleasant and most helpful. I, too, do not understand why some posters try to inflict their ideas on others and can be quite cutting if you don't agree. We are all entitled to our own opinion on matters and, just because it may not sit well with others, it is not for them to be unpleasant about it. I mean, I could have taken serious issue with Frank about us women in the GC's! but I treated him gently.
Back to education, if I may, I never taught my 3 anything either, other than to be very pleasant children/adults. 2 were 'average' , but both found their niche, daughter a 'stay at home' Mum now and son doing extremely well. Youngest son was finally diagnosed as dyslexic at the age of 20 which lifted a huge burden from him but eventually, he found what he wanted to do and all is well. I never regret my laid back attitude as I feel they had a proper childhood. IMO!!
"Anything else is both ill-mannered and stupid. it is undignified and it causes hurt and provokes quarrels. "
And that is why they do it, to provoke quarrels, All the forums have these people, if you defend yourself or the other person, they just love it, that is what they do.
It takes two to quarrel, the best bet is to say absolutely nothing, the thing they hate most is to look at how many people have 'viewed' the thread and see that 'none' have replied, when this happens a few times they will move on to another forum.
I know you feel the need to defend people, but you are playing into the hands of these 'flame baiters'
As for people on the site making nasty comments, we should really feel sorry for them, and think twice before we post to make sure it comes across as correct.
Gardening on the wild, windy west side of Dartmoor.
Tina, I am sure you did teach your children some things, ie, take themselves to the toilet and clean and wash hands after. How to sit at the table and eat a meal, to put their coats and shoes on, simple things that go completely by the wayside now, there are children that dont have these basic skills and are at a disadvantage when they start school. I must add that of course, not all are like this, but there are a fair few these days.
Gardening on the wild, windy west side of Dartmoor.
Posts
Sexist Tina, moi, not on your nelly, it is when I go into those places there seems to be three times as many women as men and they ask me I do not approach them. If asked I give a comprehensive answer and on more than one occasion have then had an escort round the place discussing plants, once even had coffee bought for me.
The local large GC had a very nice Polish lady who knew her plants, she also watered everything on the outside racks, the plants were always clean and looked after, in a buy out the good ones went and youngsters came on the scene. No watering properly, a quick flash with a hose pipe, no knowledge of the plants they read the labels and that is it. People ask questions do not get answers so leave and go elsewhere do you blame them. "Oh" and the coffee and cake went up to £7 so I do not bother.
Frank.
Hi, Tina. The trouble is that many children (ones that I taught) arrive at playschool not knowing basic things like their colours and with few language skills, because their parents do not teach them. I taught for a long time in a quite deprived area where some parents were simply not equipped to teach thier children basic life skills. Parenting classes were available but could not make up for the deprivation the parents themselves had suffereded. I always thought that the best thing the state could do for those children would be to start them at playschool at 18 months or 2 years.
Some teachers are better than others, of course. A few aren't much good, some are excellent. The trouble is that educational decisions are made by politicians with a reputations to make, not be educationalists. Chidren who could barely read and write English had the 'right' to be taught French (and Welsh in my area). Why? Also, standards of discipline have fallen and childrewn are no longer able to concentrate for extended periods of time. Probably, this will eventually come full circle and we'll have discipine and basic skills again, but right now, things are weak in that area. It is not all bad, by any means, but basic maths and English do not get enough time and attention and they do suffer.
GG I had quite a big gap between eldest 2 children and my 'baby' (33). Even in the short time, approximately 5 years, between the eldest 2 moving onto senior school and the youngest starting, I was really taken aback at how things had changed. His teacher, who had always taken reception, knowing I was a 'lady of leisure', in that I didn't work, asked me if I would be willing to help out at PE time. No, not with the games, but to dress the 5 year olds! She wished parents would stop teaching them to read, etc, and concentrate on the basics, toilet, dressing, tying shoe laces, etc. They just stood there!
Nursery school, when mine were young, were places to socialise with other children and play. School started at 5. Oh dear, I do sound old.
If you are interested, although you probably know already, have a look at the Finnish schooling system. Seems pretty good to me and I know my soon to be guest is very proud of it.
My Wife's school had one very bad teacher and everyone knew she was bad although they could not get rid of her she was young at the time. I was talking to another ex-teacher who told me she is still there and they cannot get rid of her.
We may be lucky, the schools my Grandchildren go to and have done since they were three are very good indeed. They have discipline and the teaching skills outstanding, Parents take a lot of interest and school events have to be rationed so many wish to attend.
My Grandson 12 can recite times tables, I quietly set him tasks in Math which he does in quick time, probably my genes as I excelled at maths. What I am saying is all schools differ depending on area, size, quality of Heads and Teaching Staff, I think area has more influence on things as the parents set goals. I watch my Granddaughter 8 concentrate on doing something an hour at a time and people say children have a thirty second concentration level, don't believe it, I have hopes for their future which is all we can do.
Frank.
Children with attentive, caring, relatively educated parents will do well virtually anywhere. Unfortunately, children don't start with a level playing field and the education system has to try to meet the needs of all of them.
Tina, I'm enjoying reading your responses. I was told that stuff about not teaching your child to read, teach 'em to tie their shoelaces. I didn't teach him to read. Unfortunately, since other mothers had taught their children to read, he was at a disadvantage for several years.He was underachieving and, as one teacher so tactfully told me, 'only average.'
In secondary school I did not sit down and revise for his exams with him, but let him find his level. The result - he did worse that the children whose mothers knew all the answers to the exam questions because they had coached their children for the exams. In short, I was a sucker. I disadvantaged my child.
That 'only average' child went to both Oxford and Cambridge but he still can't spell properly. So what should I really have done?
Here's a rant. I lost my temper today, which I seldom do. Although most people on this forum are charming and helpful, a minority think it is ok to make personal comments about other posters. You may think I should grow up. I may think you should grow up. Fine - but it is NOT OK to say so in a public forum. It is simply not OK to be personal, whether about other members of the forum or about well-known gardeners. Doing so says more about the person making the comments than about the person they attack or undermine. Everyone is vulnerable and everyone has faults. We need to be gentle with each other. I l love an argument if it is constructive and involves the cut and thrust of IDEAS. I also love a joke if it is without malice. Anything else is both ill-mannered and stupid. it is undignified and it causes hurt and provokes quarrels.
Hi GG, First I am very glad that you have decided to continue to post, I don't think you could have put it any better Age and Life experience speak volumes against those who have no Tolerance for another persons opinion ,I have an early start tomorrow , goodnight
Derek
I sympathise GG. Am a refugee from 'The Garden Shed' Beeb forum and, apart from the odd troll/grid, always found posters pleasant and most helpful. I, too, do not understand why some posters try to inflict their ideas on others and can be quite cutting if you don't agree. We are all entitled to our own opinion on matters and, just because it may not sit well with others, it is not for them to be unpleasant about it. I mean, I could have taken serious issue with Frank about us women in the GC's!
but I treated him gently.
Back to education, if I may, I never taught my 3 anything either, other than to be very pleasant children/adults. 2 were 'average' , but both found their niche, daughter a 'stay at home' Mum now and son doing extremely well. Youngest son was finally diagnosed as dyslexic at the age of 20 which lifted a huge burden from him but eventually, he found what he wanted to do and all is well. I never regret my laid back attitude as I feel they had a proper childhood. IMO!!
gardening grandma said
"Anything else is both ill-mannered and stupid. it is undignified and it causes hurt and provokes quarrels. "
And that is why they do it, to provoke quarrels, All the forums have these people, if you defend yourself or the other person, they just love it, that is what they do.
It takes two to quarrel, the best bet is to say absolutely nothing, the thing they hate most is to look at how many people have 'viewed' the thread and see that 'none' have replied, when this happens a few times they will move on to another forum.
I know you feel the need to defend people, but you are playing into the hands of these 'flame baiters'
As for people on the site making nasty comments, we should really feel sorry for them, and think twice before we post to make sure it comes across as correct.
Tina, I am sure you did teach your children some things, ie, take themselves to the toilet and clean and wash hands after. How to sit at the table and eat a meal, to put their coats and shoes on, simple things that go completely by the wayside now, there are children that dont have these basic skills and are at a disadvantage when they start school. I must add that of course, not all are like this, but there are a fair few these days.