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More weeds I think??

in Plants
Found these hiding in a bed previously covered with creeping buttercup, heavily disguised as geranium. I know they look a bit like a dock leaf and a dandelion but I don't think they are, but then what do I know??
Grateful for any advice.


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The top one looks like a rudbeckia, Goldsturm or similar.
I need to feel the 2nd one
shape suggests oenothera or nicotiana
In the sticks near Peterborough
Hurrah, not weeds! Nicotiana is a could guess as there are some in a pot nearby, hope so because they were lovely. Will they be safe over winter?
Hi DD. I had some Nicotiana affinis over-winter last year but it was a really easy winter here. I'd rescue it and protect it over winter.
However, I find seeds sown in early spring flower before those that have over-wintered. I only know about N. affinis and sylvestris. I haven't tried others.
re the first one; I don't grow them (not for long anyway
) but I think echinacea leaves might be that shape as well
In the sticks near Peterborough
I think the second one is Oenothera as they self seed very easily. Have just spent two hours digging them out of some of my flower beds where they don't match the colour scheme.
Thank you both, least I'm not giving TLC to weeds. You are all so clever identifying things so small, and from a picture.
So much looks the same to me. Only just worked out the difference between geraniums and buttercups. 
Try Geranium Rozanne and buttercups! Think I dug up the wrong one last spring