(Note this drawing is almost the opposite way round to the aerial photo I used earlier in the thread). Each grid square is 1m. The house is on the bottom of the picture and the sliding doors and glass back door are marked with blue rectangles. Current side wall is one blue dash, potential extension side wall is the blue dash further right and there would be a wide window between the two.
I measured up the size and shape of the garden so I could draw a scale plan today. The tree trunks and canopies are =/- about 25cm as I didn't measure those today but a mix of previous measurements, google maps and memory I've put the 2 biggest trees in with heavy dashing for their current canopy and light dashing for their 20 year spread (the biggest one is mature and not getting wider so not that one).
I have been thinking about function and how the bit of lawn we use the most is the shady section on the north side of the big tree. I spent a while wandering around, measuring, marking out with bricks etc to test out a circular lawn shape. Specifically a 6m circle today.
I decided to test drawing up a radial / concentric circles design this evening based on that 6m circle centre point. It isn't finished and I really need to work out what to do around the shed area in the bottom corner (size of shed, bicycle access etc). The randomly ending path on the top left would probably be to a child play den. I'm not happy with the main patio area but my brain has used up the ideas for the day. It is just an approximate idea so far.
Questions: 1m paths sufficient width? 3m top right patio for seating for 2-4 but only a side table for drinks, not for eating - is this big enough? Any thoughts/suggestions/input?
If it were me, I'd decide what I definitely wanted, do that - get my main features in, and see how the rest will pan out based on my plans, which can be (and should be) subject to change or compromise.
Things often look a little different in reality, and you can move or change other aspects as you go, or add temporary plants while others grow, etc.
That’s looking great and you are doing exactly the right thing in terms of basing your design on how you use the garden and where is best for you to have shade etc. The seating area at the back also makes good use of the extra space created by the angled plot.
I agree, yes to your two questions. 1m wide path is actually rather generous but sensible. You could get away with 60cm, but plants tend to spill over paths so it may end up that effective width anyway. A 6m diameter lawn is also generous, but again, I think your instincts are right because it’s easy to nibble into later if it turns out to be bigger than you need and you want more planting room.
When your brain has had a rest - good idea to put it to one side and come back fresh - have a think about why you aren’t happy with the main patio design. Too much or too little planting? A tad bitty? Too awkward to incorporate a pergola or seating area? Do you want to hide the shed from sight from the lawn area, say, with a curved barrier or fence following the line of the path or make a feature put of it maybe even with some climbers scrambling over the roof…
Mountainous Northern Catalunya, Spain. Hot summers, cold winters.
For the 3 metre patio, try marking out that area (on the lawn will do) and try putting some chairs and a table on there, see if there's room for people to get up and walk around to the path without other people having to move their chairs, things like that. Reclining chairs take up more space than upright ones, and if you have small children they might want room to sit on the floor and play near where the adults are sitting. Plants might spill over the edges too, so it might be better to have it bigger. You could make it so that it touches the circular path.
You might find that people cut across the corners where the two paths intersect, so you might want to think about the planting there - four big containers at the corners, topiary cones/balls that are too high to step over, etc.
Doncaster, South Yorkshire. Soil type: sandy, well-drained
I like all these 'strong shapes' but sometimes it's nice to go 'organic.'
I can't draw organic shapes so I tend to just copy shapes from nature e.g. giraffe patterns. In this case I've added a circular lawn, admittedly a lawn that size isn't really practical and you could just omit or use paving.
"What is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbour".
If it were me, I'd decide what I definitely wanted, do that - get my main features in, and see how the rest will pan out based on my plans, which can be (and should be) subject to change or compromise.
Things often look a little different in reality, and you can move or change other aspects as you go, or add temporary plants while others grow, etc.
@Slow-worm Thank you for that. I know pretty well what I want (more planting, less patio, less lawn, that shady lawn space, some sunny patio space, a shady patio space (which is what I have put in the back corner), shed for bicycles/tools but narrower than existing shed etc) I know where most of those need to go but it is trying to work out the shapes.
As you say a temporary set up could be useful and I did think of cutting out whatever lawn shape I like, maybe clearing some turf and sowing a simple annual like Phacelia to see how it works before getting into hard landscaping and planting bigger plants.
[...]The seating area at the back also makes good use of the extra space created by the angled plot.
[...]1m wide path is actually rather generous but sensible. You could get away with 60cm, but plants tend to spill over paths so it may end up that effective width anyway. A 6m diameter lawn is also generous [...]
[...] have a think about why you aren’t happy with the main patio design. Too much or too little planting? A tad bitty? Too awkward to incorporate a pergola or seating area? Do you want to hide the shed from sight from the lawn area, say, with a curved barrier or fence following the line of the path or make a feature put of it maybe even with some climbers scrambling over the roof…
That back corner is shaded from midday by some trees behind our garden so I plan to have that as a shady patio as in high summer from midday onwards the patio near the house is unusably hot. I might put a pergola with climbers to create more shade over it.
I'll mark out some path widths before deciding. As the beds on the right are 1.5m wide I thought 1m path might make it easier to tend plants as well. It is funny as the 6m lawn is so much smaller than what we currently have so it doesn't feel generous. But then it isn't like we use it much so it is pointless having that much grass.
You questions about the patio are all the same things going through my mind. I want planting to reduce the heat on the house bricks but then that ends up with the bitty beds against the walls. This particular radial design didn't really work around the patio but I will try a different shape next. It is hard to tell how much space to leave for seating - we have 2 camping chairs and that is it so working out space for table and chairs for a meal is tricky. I don't want the table and chairs (or shed) in front of a door blocking the view of the garden.
I want to hide the shed as much as possible and that thin green line was wires to run screening climbers along. I was also thinking a climber going over the roof. I need to work out how to fit in a shed big enough for bikes and tools, a wheely bin, a whole collection of recycling bins plus the access to all of those and the turning space for wheeling a bicycle down the side path and round to the shed (probably a wide side door). I can't mark up on the ground as the existing shed is right in the way so it is harder to work it out.
For the 3 metre patio, try marking out that area (on the lawn will do) and try putting some chairs and a table on there, see if there's room[...] You could make it so that it touches the circular path.
You might find that people cut across the corners where the two paths intersect, so you might want to think about the planting there - four big containers at the corners, topiary cones/balls that are too high to step over, etc.
I do need to mark out that area next and test fit some chairs. There is quite a bit of space to move it around/change size as needed but I was tucking it in the back corner to get as much shade as possible. I could also put a pergola with climbers to make more shade over it though.
That is a good suggestion to think about those corners, I hadn't considered that at all.
I like all these 'strong shapes' but sometimes it's nice to go 'organic.'
I can't draw organic shapes so I tend to just copy shapes from nature e.g. giraffe patterns. In this case I've added a circular lawn, admittedly a lawn that size isn't really practical and you could just omit or use paving.
@Loxley There's something I hadn't even remotely considered! Such an inventive idea. It works very well and I can imagine a gravel/prairie type planting working really well with that. I will have a think about it.
Posts
(Note this drawing is almost the opposite way round to the aerial photo I used earlier in the thread). Each grid square is 1m. The house is on the bottom of the picture and the sliding doors and glass back door are marked with blue rectangles. Current side wall is one blue dash, potential extension side wall is the blue dash further right and there would be a wide window between the two.
I measured up the size and shape of the garden so I could draw a scale plan today. The tree trunks and canopies are =/- about 25cm as I didn't measure those today but a mix of previous measurements, google maps and memory I've put the 2 biggest trees in with heavy dashing for their current canopy and light dashing for their 20 year spread (the biggest one is mature and not getting wider so not that one).
I have been thinking about function and how the bit of lawn we use the most is the shady section on the north side of the big tree. I spent a while wandering around, measuring, marking out with bricks etc to test out a circular lawn shape. Specifically a 6m circle today.
I decided to test drawing up a radial / concentric circles design this evening based on that 6m circle centre point. It isn't finished and I really need to work out what to do around the shed area in the bottom corner (size of shed, bicycle access etc). The randomly ending path on the top left would probably be to a child play den. I'm not happy with the main patio area but my brain has used up the ideas for the day. It is just an approximate idea so far.
Questions:
1m paths sufficient width?
3m top right patio for seating for 2-4 but only a side table for drinks, not for eating - is this big enough?
Any thoughts/suggestions/input?
If it were me, I'd decide what I definitely wanted, do that - get my main features in, and see how the rest will pan out based on my plans, which can be (and should be) subject to change or compromise.
Things often look a little different in reality, and you can move or change other aspects as you go, or add temporary plants while others grow, etc.
I agree, yes to your two questions. 1m wide path is actually rather generous but sensible. You could get away with 60cm, but plants tend to spill over paths so it may end up that effective width anyway. A 6m diameter lawn is also generous, but again, I think your instincts are right because it’s easy to nibble into later if it turns out to be bigger than you need and you want more planting room.
When your brain has had a rest - good idea to put it to one side and come back fresh - have a think about why you aren’t happy with the main patio design. Too much or too little planting? A tad bitty? Too awkward to incorporate a pergola or seating area? Do you want to hide the shed from sight from the lawn area, say, with a curved barrier or fence following the line of the path or make a feature put of it maybe even with some climbers scrambling over the roof…
I can't draw organic shapes so I tend to just copy shapes from nature e.g. giraffe patterns. In this case I've added a circular lawn, admittedly a lawn that size isn't really practical and you could just omit or use paving.
As you say a temporary set up could be useful and I did think of cutting out whatever lawn shape I like, maybe clearing some turf and sowing a simple annual like Phacelia to see how it works before getting into hard landscaping and planting bigger plants.
That back corner is shaded from midday by some trees behind our garden so I plan to have that as a shady patio as in high summer from midday onwards the patio near the house is unusably hot. I might put a pergola with climbers to create more shade over it.
I'll mark out some path widths before deciding. As the beds on the right are 1.5m wide I thought 1m path might make it easier to tend plants as well. It is funny as the 6m lawn is so much smaller than what we currently have so it doesn't feel generous. But then it isn't like we use it much so it is pointless having that much grass.
You questions about the patio are all the same things going through my mind. I want planting to reduce the heat on the house bricks but then that ends up with the bitty beds against the walls. This particular radial design didn't really work around the patio but I will try a different shape next. It is hard to tell how much space to leave for seating - we have 2 camping chairs and that is it so working out space for table and chairs for a meal is tricky. I don't want the table and chairs (or shed) in front of a door blocking the view of the garden.
I want to hide the shed as much as possible and that thin green line was wires to run screening climbers along. I was also thinking a climber going over the roof. I need to work out how to fit in a shed big enough for bikes and tools, a wheely bin, a whole collection of recycling bins plus the access to all of those and the turning space for wheeling a bicycle down the side path and round to the shed (probably a wide side door). I can't mark up on the ground as the existing shed is right in the way so it is harder to work it out.
I do need to mark out that area next and test fit some chairs. There is quite a bit of space to move it around/change size as needed but I was tucking it in the back corner to get as much shade as possible. I could also put a pergola with climbers to make more shade over it though.
That is a good suggestion to think about those corners, I hadn't considered that at all.