If it were needed, why can't we make it? We have all the ingredients to hand surely.
No.. all you'd end up with is a very fine superficial material - in the case of sandstone or gritstone - crushed rock essentially. Generally speaking, igneous rock is just too hard (it makes great railway ballast) although quarry 'tailings' can be a useful addition to topsoil. Neither can you "make" clay which primarily is a result of chemical weathering of siliceous rock (shale or mudstone for example)
Soil is a result of thousands of years weathering primarily due the action of water..See below..
Soils are a result of hundreds of millions of years of geological processes - volcanic, sedimentary, glacial, fluvial - crushing, pressing, eroding, life living and dying (limestones, chalk), sands weathering, mountains being thrust up and wearing down.
Could you not recreate that though artificially and quickly? I'm not suggesting we should, just can't see why we couldn't. You can grind and wear any stone down if you wish at many levels. We can make leaf mould, wood chip, sawdust, compost, sand, grit etc All those mixed up will make a 'growing medium' which will support wildlife and plantlife. If it isn't actual soil, it's pretty close.
I was involved in a project a couple of years ago where the question was asked if we could manufacture soil (I won't bore you with the reasons). The ecologist type person on the team just said sadly '"we actually have no idea how to do it. We can create the mineral environment, but we can't recreate the ecosystem that makes it 'work' for plants. You'd get a sterile growing medium, but you wouldn't get soil"
Gardening on the edge of Exmoor, in Devon
“It's still magic even if you know how it's done.”
As a geologist.. we don't normally deal with soil, but what I remember was there's two soil building processes, (or rather weathering processes) physical which has been mentioned, that includes things like wind and water erosion and frost damage and chemical which is increased by things such as plants and lichens. Both of these are faster in warm wet climates, but soil removal processes are also faster in those climates.
so that 20cm is perfectly fine as a number.
Think of your garden, how long has it been since that was bare rock? since the ice age? now how much soil do you have? I have 30cm over chalk. In many places soil doesn't get deeper at all.
I was involved in a project a couple of years ago where the question was asked if we could manufacture soil (I won't bore you with the reasons). The ecologist type person on the team just said sadly '"we actually have no idea how to do it. We can create the mineral environment, but we can't recreate the ecosystem that makes it 'work' for plants. You'd get a sterile growing medium, but you wouldn't get soil"
Yet I've made my own and successfully grow plants in it. As per above if you want to be precise then it's a 'growing medium', but it works. The peat free composts we buy now are largely made from the rubbish we throw out, that isn't a good example though given people are reporting it's still rubbish! Plants are weak, germination poor. My own has a greater success rate.
If a man-made soil is different to the original, I wonder if it fails to do something and if so, what?
If it were needed, why can't we make it? We have all the ingredients to hand surely.
No.. all you'd end up with is a very fine superficial material - in the case of sandstone or gritstone - crushed rock essentially. Generally speaking, igneous rock is just too hard (it makes great railway ballast) although quarry 'tailings' can be a useful addition to topsoil. Neither can you "make" clay which primarily is a result of chemical weathering of siliceous rock (shale or mudstone for example)
Soil is a result of thousands of years weathering primarily due the action of water..See below..
Soils are a result of hundreds of millions of years of geological processes - volcanic, sedimentary, glacial, fluvial - crushing, pressing, eroding, life living and dying (limestones, chalk), sands weathering, mountains being thrust up and wearing down.
Could you not recreate that though artificially and quickly? I'm not suggesting we should, just can't see why we couldn't. You can grind and wear any stone down if you wish at many levels. We can make leaf mould, wood chip, sawdust, compost, sand, grit etc All those mixed up will make a 'growing medium' which will support wildlife and plantlife. If it isn't actual soil, it's pretty close.
No..you can't speed up the many geological processes. Soil is very different from a 'growing medium' primarily due to the organic & mineral components not to mention the actual physical properties. Growing media or compost contains organic material almost exclusively & takes a very short time to decompose - rock on the other hand takes thousands of years & involves way more variables & processes (it doesn't decompose, it weathers)- crushing rock just makes crushed rock.
soil is not inert. It is a complex ecosystem of biological organisms, bacteria, fungi, invertebrates and others, as well as organic material and minerals. I'm told we don't even know what some of them are, let alone what their purpose is in the overall structure, so we aren't able to breed/grow/clone them. We can make mud, sand, loam etc, but not soil. I'm not an expert on this by any means - just repeating what I've been told by someone who's information I trust.
Gardening on the edge of Exmoor, in Devon
“It's still magic even if you know how it's done.”
If it were needed, why can't we make it? We have all the ingredients to hand surely.
No.. all you'd end up with is a very fine superficial material - in the case of sandstone or gritstone - crushed rock essentially. Generally speaking, igneous rock is just too hard (it makes great railway ballast) although quarry 'tailings' can be a useful addition to topsoil. Neither can you "make" clay which primarily is a result of chemical weathering of siliceous rock (shale or mudstone for example)
Soil is a result of thousands of years weathering primarily due the action of water..See below..
Soils are a result of hundreds of millions of years of geological processes - volcanic, sedimentary, glacial, fluvial - crushing, pressing, eroding, life living and dying (limestones, chalk), sands weathering, mountains being thrust up and wearing down.
Could you not recreate that though artificially and quickly? I'm not suggesting we should, just can't see why we couldn't. You can grind and wear any stone down if you wish at many levels. We can make leaf mould, wood chip, sawdust, compost, sand, grit etc All those mixed up will make a 'growing medium' which will support wildlife and plantlife. If it isn't actual soil, it's pretty close.
No..you can't speed up the many geological processes. Soil is very different from a 'growing medium' primarily due to the organic & mineral components not to mention the actual physical properties. Growing media or compost contains organic material almost exclusively & takes a very short time to decompose - rock on the other hand takes thousands of years & involves way more variables & processes (it doesn't decompose, it weathers)- crushing rock just makes crushed rock.
I can weather stone, I put my power washer to it! Industrial water jets are so powerful they will cut and erode stone and metal in milliseconds. We can replicate or speed up many processes. I believe we can make man-made soil, but as per my previous post what it doesn't bring to the party that the original does I don't know. It certainly supports life. We could go on forever, soil from one site is completely different to another for instance. Then of course at the other extreme we grow plants by hydroponics. I respectfully disagree, but don't want to argue it. Thanks for putting your point across in an adult manner.
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You can grind and wear any stone down if you wish at many levels.
We can make leaf mould, wood chip, sawdust, compost, sand, grit etc
All those mixed up will make a 'growing medium' which will support wildlife and plantlife. If it isn't actual soil, it's pretty close.
“It's still magic even if you know how it's done.”
The peat free composts we buy now are largely made from the rubbish we throw out, that isn't a good example though given people are reporting it's still rubbish! Plants are weak, germination poor.
My own has a greater success rate.
If a man-made soil is different to the original, I wonder if it fails to do something and if so, what?
Soil is very different from a 'growing medium' primarily due to the organic & mineral components not to mention the actual physical properties.
Growing media or compost contains organic material almost exclusively & takes a very short time to decompose - rock on the other hand takes thousands of years & involves way more variables & processes (it doesn't decompose, it weathers)- crushing rock just makes crushed rock.
As I posted earlier … compost aka growing medium is not topsoil
https://horticulture.co.uk/compost-vs-soil/
Gardening in Central Norfolk on improved gritty moraine over chalk ... free-draining.
“It's still magic even if you know how it's done.”
We can replicate or speed up many processes.
I believe we can make man-made soil, but as per my previous post what it doesn't bring to the party that the original does I don't know. It certainly supports life.
We could go on forever, soil from one site is completely different to another for instance.
Then of course at the other extreme we grow plants by hydroponics.
I respectfully disagree, but don't want to argue it. Thanks for putting your point across in an adult manner.