The additional photos and explanations help. However, I believe TGG has fairly stiff canes - to zig zag or weave you would need a rose with much more flexible canes. Would you agree with that @Obelixx?
Why not compromise and at least accept unanimous advice on the one in the (admittedly large!) pot? Get something more suitable for that, a shorter climber or pillar rose, or better still a repeat flowering shrub rose to give you fragrant blooms at nose level. Perfect for next to your outdoor seating there.
Then you can attempt to train the one in the ground. The only option there is to fan 2-4 canes on the (ideally widened) trellis and then curve them up and above the window and door on tensioned wires stretched horizontally, 18” apart. So one or two canes each way, depending on the space there. It will look pretty bare below, though, plus access and maintenance will be harder and more time consuming. First you need the canes to do that and you might have to wait a season or two to get suitable new semi-flexible basal growth. I applaud your determination to make the best of it, but do you really want to try bending a rose to your will, against it’s nature, when you are already time poor? Your choice!
Mountainous Northern Catalunya, Spain. Hot summers, cold winters.
Yes @Nollie - GG is very stiff stemmed. Even the shorter flowering stems thrown up off the main stems get stiff fairly quickly. I had one in my last garden and trained to 3 or 4 horizontal stems each spring and then fed it and by mid summer it was a riot of new stems and flowers and by late summer it needed refereeing again too stop it being blown apart by autumn gales and taking its trellis fence with it.
If you want a bendy rose you really need a repeat flowering rambler such as Lady of the Lake, Snow Goose, Albrichton Rambler or Malvern Hills. Another possibility would be one of the shorter DA climbers that won't mind being confined to a small trellis. Teasing Georgia is good or maybe Strawberry Hill or St Swithin. You can research all these - colour, perfume, size - on the David Austin website.
Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
"The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
I thought that was the case, thanks @Obelixx. Snap, keeping with the pink theme, I was going to suggest Strawberry Hill as a small climber for the pot, or Gertrude Jekyll for a freestanding, very fragrant tall shrub which that large pot would also accommodate.
Mountainous Northern Catalunya, Spain. Hot summers, cold winters.
I didn't suggest Gertrude because she has vicious thorns and isn't one you want to walking past, next to a path or door. Gorgeous rose and strong perfume tho and yes, I had one in my last garden.
Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
"The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
The pot is actually pretty huge - 90cm tall and 75cm wide, and full to about 6 inches below the top. And I’ve been mulching, feeding and watering so far. Both the roses look very healthy and haven’t been affected by insects save for a few aphids here and there.
..that's good.. no problems.. the pot is a good size... nobody keeps these things forever, so good for several years .. I'm concerned at the lack of blooms, it should have lots of them now.. feed with liquid tomato fertilizer to promote bud development..
What I’m hoping for is some advice on how I can best make use of the trellis space I do have, which is widths of 3 foot (white trellis) and 4 foot (wood trellis), and 6 foot height; then with space above both trellises for the rose to spread left and right above. I will add a couple more pictures to show the space better.
Clearly I need to abandon my single main stem approach. Should I aim to fan out 4-6 main stems, or is it better with my 3/4 foot width to go for a zig zag?
..forget the zig zagging nonsense.. just let it grow up, and try to angle the canes somewhat.. so yes, fan out if you can... tie in as you go, some stems there on the potted rose to the left, are getting a bit wayward and odd looking as they have nowhere to go.. also those laterals, after they've finished flowering, you will be cutting them out or reducing the length, so fussy tying in isn't needed.. Relax, it doesn't look too bad actually... you've done quite well there so far.. and this is a fairly easy rose to manage..
Any other thoughts much appreciated. Typing this at half time in the football, so hope it all makes sense!!
..no idea about the football, but here's some advice for you, if you're still around.. think of it as alternative advice rather than contradictory to what's already been said..
..so called 'Climbing Roses' are in effect large arching shrubs, designated by the breeder and vendor as climbers for marketing purposes, as that's how they are seen to best advantage due to their growth habits... it is assumed the gardener has sufficient framework in place to accommodate such a large shrub... you don't quite have that currently, so what you will need to do is to return the 'large arching shrub'.. to a 'not so large arching shrub' form, and keep it that way.. 2 ways to do that... I'll explain it further if you're still around, as it takes time and I would need to upload photos.. Besides, it's time for my lunch..
Thanks for the comments Marlorena (and everyone). I am still around and would love to hear the additional explanations if you have time to post!
Both plants did bloom profusely but I have been dead heading them, and then got a bit trigger happy in trying to tie in / train the stems based on my misunderstanding of the task at hand! I fed them with the David Austin rose feed at the start of the season and recently re-applied.
I should also add to clarify re the trellis and what I am hoping to achieve… I would certainly plan to use wire to train both plants above the trellis, fanning out left and right from the top. There is actually a small wire already attached above / left of the trellis on the potted rose, which I was planning to use as a starting point to support the rose in that direction.
ok.. that's not too bad then, if you have some wire supports going on there..
... there are 2 ways you can grow TGG, as like most Austins they are fairly adaptable...
.. this was my plant grown within an obelisk, which is 6 feet tall.. as you can see much narrower than what you have there..
..at 6 feet, still quite manageable.. ignore the deep pink rose, I sometimes plant 2 together in the same hole, as here, and they grow and merge.. I find TGG rather pale, and wanted something stronger.. this is still narrower I think than your trellis.. .. either towards the end of the first year, more likely the 2nd or even the 3rd season, it will throw up these vigorous basals, something that all of us salivate at, when we see them... it is these basals, which are capable of 10-12 feet extension growth, that give the rose its 'climbing' designation... if you don't have the framework in place, you can remove them by just yanking them off.. this keeps the rose to a smaller climbing/shrub form by removing that larger growth potential.. ..otherwise it will go up and up.. the alternative is to allow these canes to grow to their height, they will flower and produce a few laterals, and then prune hard back to within the support trellis.. this may mean pruning off as much as 5 foot or so.. this also returns the rose to manageable shrub/small climbing form.. ..if you keep them, some angling of the cane is best to produce these lateral side shoots.. it's these that will produce blooms at the top - they can grow 2 or 3 feet long, even more.. after flowering they can be pruned right out back to the main cane there, or to where you see another bud breaking or as I prefer, to a stub of about 3 inches or so... from that, they should shoot out again to rebloom..
I use copious amounts of green string, tying cane to cane, or to whatever support I've got.. shaping as I go... that of course is up to you.. Your rose against the white trellis seems to have more leeway for growing.. I was wondering if you plan to put some white trellis along the top for instance?..
..Your potted rose doesn't have so much scope there.. I was thinking if you could put another piece of brown trellis on the left wall where there is some silver protrusion, not sure what that is, that would give you somewhere to tie in those wayward canes and spread it out a bit..
I don't find what you are doing problematic, I might find the colour of TGG as I mentioned, somewhat pale.. especially against a white wall.. that would have been a consideration for me, but I do like strong colours more than most people..
I hope this helps you out somewhat... if not, well, no problem because you will learn as you go and discover how your rose operates, and then deal with it..
Thanks @Marlorena that is all really helpful! I will think about the best combo of wire / trellis above the existing trellises, seems like that would be a good bet.
I must say I agree that the colour of the GG rose doesn’t “pop” very much against my white walls, but it’s all a learning curve!
hi @matt.fritzqVrm8wuN I realise I am very late to the party but I found this post interesting. I can't find the video but I saw an online tutorial on training roses on narrow trellis' before. I have probably made a big mistake but I have trained my climbing roses, in a zig zag, up a very narrow trellis arbour. Maybe I should also use wire and attach to a surrounding wall. Anyway, I also have grown mine in pots and accept there will be limitations in growth, but after 2-3 years they're still absolutely fine.
Posts
Why not compromise and at least accept unanimous advice on the one in the (admittedly large!) pot? Get something more suitable for that, a shorter climber or pillar rose, or better still a repeat flowering shrub rose to give you fragrant blooms at nose level. Perfect for next to your outdoor seating there.
If you want a bendy rose you really need a repeat flowering rambler such as Lady of the Lake, Snow Goose, Albrichton Rambler or Malvern Hills. Another possibility would be one of the shorter DA climbers that won't mind being confined to a small trellis. Teasing Georgia is good or maybe Strawberry Hill or St Swithin. You can research all these - colour, perfume, size - on the David Austin website.
... there are 2 ways you can grow TGG, as like most Austins they are fairly adaptable...
.. this was my plant grown within an obelisk, which is 6 feet tall.. as you can see much narrower than what you have there..
..at 6 feet, still quite manageable.. ignore the deep pink rose, I sometimes plant 2 together in the same hole, as here, and they grow and merge.. I find TGG rather pale, and wanted something stronger.. this is still narrower I think than your trellis..
.. either towards the end of the first year, more likely the 2nd or even the 3rd season, it will throw up these vigorous basals, something that all of us salivate at, when we see them... it is these basals, which are capable of 10-12 feet extension growth, that give the rose its 'climbing' designation... if you don't have the framework in place, you can remove them by just yanking them off.. this keeps the rose to a smaller climbing/shrub form by removing that larger growth potential..
..otherwise it will go up and up.. the alternative is to allow these canes to grow to their height, they will flower and produce a few laterals, and then prune hard back to within the support trellis.. this may mean pruning off as much as 5 foot or so.. this also returns the rose to manageable shrub/small climbing form..
..if you keep them, some angling of the cane is best to produce these lateral side shoots.. it's these that will produce blooms at the top - they can grow 2 or 3 feet long, even more.. after flowering they can be pruned right out back to the main cane there, or to where you see another bud breaking or as I prefer, to a stub of about 3 inches or so... from that, they should shoot out again to rebloom..
I use copious amounts of green string, tying cane to cane, or to whatever support I've got.. shaping as I go... that of course is up to you..
Your rose against the white trellis seems to have more leeway for growing.. I was wondering if you plan to put some white trellis along the top for instance?..
..Your potted rose doesn't have so much scope there.. I was thinking if you could put another piece of brown trellis on the left wall where there is some silver protrusion, not sure what that is, that would give you somewhere to tie in those wayward canes and spread it out a bit..
I don't find what you are doing problematic, I might find the colour of TGG as I mentioned, somewhat pale.. especially against a white wall.. that would have been a consideration for me, but I do like strong colours more than most people..
I hope this helps you out somewhat... if not, well, no problem because you will learn as you go and discover how your rose operates, and then deal with it..
Thanks again for the help 😀