Fireworks wants to get between 2 and 4 m high and wide so if the only space is a narrow trellis I would treat it as a group 3 and prune it low every year then give it a generous feed of slow release fertiliser for clematis, roses or tomatoes and a good deep drink and then a mulch of well-rotted garden compost, manure or bought-in soil improver.
I would not add a rose as competition for either root space and nutrients or air space for growing.
Treated as a group 3, it will produce healthy new stems and foliage every spring and flower thru most of the summer. If you train the stems in regularly you can spread them horizontally and diagonally to improve flowering vigour.
Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
"The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
They can and do but in my last garden winters were harsh and usually did for any top growth that might have flowered so, rather than try and work my way thru every stem looking for a healthy bud in all the tangle of dead stems I took to treating them like group 3s and cutting off every stem. It meant I got a single, longer flowering season that started a bit later but went on longer.
One of those clematis was Nelly Moser, a parent of Fireworks.
Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
"The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
First post and need some clematis pruning advise. I'm not sure whether my clematis are group 2 or 3 (this is my second year of owning a house with an established garden); they flowered in May 2020 but I think because it was so hot in Spring. They seem to grow very easily and I think in summer 2019 they flowered in June.
I've followed advise to go down to the lower most bud but supposedly this should be around 30cm high; however many of the first buds are more like 1m high! Picture below of the clematis post my initial pruning.
I'm very new to gardening and trying (and mostly succeeding) to keep a wonderful garden looking nice.
Sorry - struggling to get this the correct orientation
Until you can identify what your clematis might be it's fine to prune down to the lowest healthy bud but beware of doing it too soon in case that last bud gets zapped by a late frost. Leaving on the upper stems till mid to late March will help protect the buds. Once you have pruned it, feed it and make sure you train in new stems as they grow and before you get a total tangle.
Just like roses, clematis are hungry, thirsty plants, so whichever it is, your clematis will appreciate a good feed which can be an annual spring dose of slow release fertiliser granules for roses, clematis or tomatoes as those all encourage healthy growth and flowers. It's also important to give the roots a good mulch with well-rotted garden compost or manure or soil conditioner from a GC if you don't have access to the first 2. Pile it on a couple of inches think when the soil is damp because that will help retain moisture and make sure you give a generous drink of 10 to 15 litres a couple of times a week in hot, dry spells.
Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
"The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
Thanks; great advice - I'm quite far south so fingers crossed there won't be another heavy frost. This particular clematis grew to the top of the fence pretty quickly last year; can you train the stems sideways (or even downwards) as otherwise it starts going over the fence and the neighbours get to enjoy all the flowers!
Will I be able to identify which group it is in purely from when it flowers or are there any other tell-tell signs?
You can train clematis stems horizontally, diagonally, through other plants, up obelisks and over arches - just have have the support ready and keep an eye out for new growth needing a bit of guidance.
The flowers will help identify - colour, size, any bars on back or front, colour of anthers - but, to be honest, my last garden was so cold that none of my group 2 clematis ever had any decent growth left so I treated them all as group 3s and pruned them hard in spring. It just meant they flowered in one long flush thru summer instead of a flush in May/June and another later on in late summer. Much easier to manage on the whole.
Vendée - 20kms from Atlantic coast.
"The price good men (and women) pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men (and women)."
Final question (for now). When you say hard pruning would that be cutting down to about 30cm above ground level regardless of whether there are any buds there? A lot of the guidance talks about a hard prune to the lower most buds at about 30cm high but as in my picture above my lowest buds are at a metre.
Quote from RHS website on pruning group 3: "Cut back to just above a strong pair of leaf buds about 30cm (1ft) above soil level"
So what's more important, lowest healthy bud or going down to ~30cm?
Sadly not quite that easy. Some vigorous Clematis can just be cut down to a foot, whether there are buds or not, with other less vigorous types, you are better cutting to the lowest buds.
How can you lie there and think of England When you don't even know who's in the team
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Fireworks wants to get between 2 and 4 m high and wide so if the only space is a narrow trellis I would treat it as a group 3 and prune it low every year then give it a generous feed of slow release fertiliser for clematis, roses or tomatoes and a good deep drink and then a mulch of well-rotted garden compost, manure or bought-in soil improver.
I would not add a rose as competition for either root space and nutrients or air space for growing.
Treated as a group 3, it will produce healthy new stems and foliage every spring and flower thru most of the summer. If you train the stems in regularly you can spread them horizontally and diagonally to improve flowering vigour.
One of those clematis was Nelly Moser, a parent of Fireworks.
I've followed advise to go down to the lower most bud but supposedly this should be around 30cm high; however many of the first buds are more like 1m high! Picture below of the clematis post my initial pruning.
I'm very new to gardening and trying (and mostly succeeding) to keep a wonderful garden looking nice.
Sorry - struggling to get this the correct orientation
Just like roses, clematis are hungry, thirsty plants, so whichever it is, your clematis will appreciate a good feed which can be an annual spring dose of slow release fertiliser granules for roses, clematis or tomatoes as those all encourage healthy growth and flowers. It's also important to give the roots a good mulch with well-rotted garden compost or manure or soil conditioner from a GC if you don't have access to the first 2. Pile it on a couple of inches think when the soil is damp because that will help retain moisture and make sure you give a generous drink of 10 to 15 litres a couple of times a week in hot, dry spells.
Will I be able to identify which group it is in purely from when it flowers or are there any other tell-tell signs?
The flowers will help identify - colour, size, any bars on back or front, colour of anthers - but, to be honest, my last garden was so cold that none of my group 2 clematis ever had any decent growth left so I treated them all as group 3s and pruned them hard in spring. It just meant they flowered in one long flush thru summer instead of a flush in May/June and another later on in late summer. Much easier to manage on the whole.
Final question (for now). When you say hard pruning would that be cutting down to about 30cm above ground level regardless of whether there are any buds there? A lot of the guidance talks about a hard prune to the lower most buds at about 30cm high but as in my picture above my lowest buds are at a metre.
Quote from RHS website on pruning group 3: "Cut back to just above a strong pair of leaf buds about 30cm (1ft) above soil level"
So what's more important, lowest healthy bud or going down to ~30cm?
Some vigorous Clematis can just be cut down to a foot, whether there are buds or not, with other less vigorous types, you are better cutting to the lowest buds.
When you don't even know who's in the team
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