@Dannyboy334 I've just been out to measure my bamboo trough, which is 50 cms depth x 85 cm long. The bamboo was (I think) Phyllostachys fargesia which lasted about 10 years before it died on me in the hot weather in 2018 (it was high up on a south facing terrace in a stone trough) so not the best of places. I would go for Version 4 - the moveable bench and if you mount it on locking castors, would be easier to move. I do hope though you're costing this all out before you commit yourself - my guess is anywhere between £10-£20K, judging on my own garden landscaping project and that was 12 years ago. It's so easy to get carried away!
@Lizzie27 I will go for option 4. The casters are a great idea for the bench thanks. I am willing to spend £20k at a push as I intend to make this my forever home.
I guess my last remaining concerns are the planting arrangements. I want plants that will last at least 40-50 years and be low maintenance. For the planter coming out into the middle of the garden I was thinking of attaching a metal rusted look frame like the image below and attaching it to the beam of the pergola. What climbers would be best growing up this? I do like the look of the climber in the image below. In the image below how many years of growth are we talking to get to that state?
I had seen instant green fences from mobilane which would provide instant privacy. Please see the two images below. The second image shows the range they offer.
For the back wall I guess I have two options.
Option one of climbers growing up the wall and continuing up my extra metal wire frame. If I were to have climbers would they be able to stretch over to the left hand side of the wall to the left of the gate, so I get full wall coverage with only a soil bed to the right of the gate? Any climbers anyone could suggest.
Option two of evergreen privet trees meaning I would not need that metal wire on top of the brick wall. Could I have the trunks of the privet trees right up against that back wall and allow the crowns to over hang the 250mm thick back wall to give some extra breathing room for my main feature tree. If anyone feels I do not have enough space for the privet trees I could scale back the main patio by 300mm to allow for space.
For the squares where I have stones could I plant no maintenance succulent plants to add a bit of greenery?
The two boundary fences are 1800mm tall but the back wall is 2000mm tall to allow a gate to be fully enclosed. I wonder would I be better lowering that wall height to 1800mm to match the fences either side and just leave a gap at the top of the gate?
Any finally any ideas of what tree with a wide enough wide to fully stretch across the whole garden which is 4420mm wide.
@dannyboy10, I think the plant in the photo with the orange flowers is possibly Thunbergia alata and if so, it would have made that growth in one year as it is an annual plant. That means, it dies over the winter, you pull off the dead stuff and then buy new plants every year, so not low maintenance unfortunately. I think you would be better off with an evergreen climber on the back wall such as a Trachelosperum asiatica or jasminoides, which grows slightly bigger to 9 m. Can be trained widthways. Both have small white/cream flowers in summer and I find mine very low maintenance. I just cut off wavy stems where I don't want them. Mine's got to about 3 m in about 4 or 4 years I think. I believe the tree privets, although striking, would need too much maintenance as they grow quite quickly. We cut our privet hedge every 6-8 weeks throughout the summer and at that height, you would need a ladder and a hedge trimmer, either battery or electric.
Please don't get plastic ivy hedges - the ones I've seen are awful!
For the right angled centre planter, it occurs to me that you could site the base of this on good soil, which would give a climber sufficient room for roots and cut down on the watering, so less maintenance. Here I would go for an evergreen clematis like Clematis cirrhosa 'Freckles', which flowers over the winter with cream bell-shaped flowers with red freckles inside - a subtle match to the red brick. I find this quite vigorous and again low maintenance. The root system wouldn't be a problem.
If you had a solid bench with a hinged lid, you could keep your gardening tools/cushions in it.
A couple of extra points. An outside tap (if there's room on the house wall) would be an asset, as would electric wiring for outside lighting. This would need to be laid before the paving and you'd need a lighting specialist for this. You mentioned reclaimed bricks for your walls. You cannot use old house bricks taken from inside the house for outside use as they are not frostproof and will surface flake and overtime will disintregate. So for your outside walls you will need to specify which ones you want. Although general builders are probably quite capable of outdoor constructions it is not a given that they will understand plant requirements for soil, water and space, so do bear this in mind.
One other important point is where your drains are and hopefully your solicitor should have a plan from the local water authority. In most old terrace houses, the drains and sewers are communal and usually run right along about half way down the gardens, parallel with the houses. There should be at least one drain cover in your garden which must not be paved over in case you need access to clear any blocked sewers (quite a common occurrence in a line of terraced houses - think disposable nappies/wipes etc!). The way round this is to cover the manhole with a metal purpose-built grid which then holds one of your paving slabs and which can then be lifted out if necessary. The alternative which many people use is just to put a big pot or trough over the original drain cover depending on where that is.
I'm still thinking about the tree so will come back later. Sorry it's such a long post but I'm enjoying this.
Just to let you know those instant hedges I linked to are real plants and not plastic, just in case you thought they were plastic.
I just looked up the Trachelospermum climber you suggested for the back wall. It states on the RHS website it supports south,west or east facing aspect but no mention of north facing. Do you think because it is at the back of the garden it should get some decent sunlight still as the house should not cast a shadow on that part of the garden due to how far back it is. You can see the images I posted earlier of a sun study of the back garden but please bare in in mind I will be adding a 2 metre single story extension out into the garden which is not shown in the sun study photos I previously took. Just to note the size of the garden I have shown on this thread takes into account the extension already having being built.
One extra thing I had thought about this climber is would things progress quicker if I grew it from both sides of the wall. Would a piece of soil jutting out 200mm from the small piece of wall on the left of the gate be enough space, this would still allow me to fit the bike in that part of the garden or else the bin and the bike at the opposite side.
For the right angled centre planter you mentioned Clematis cirrhosa as the climber, I just looked that one up on the RHS website and it does look beautiful. The only issue I can see is that it states it needs south facing or west facing sun. Will this pose a problem with my North facing garden?
I forgot to mention I will also need climbers for the pergola, are there any that you can suggest.
I was thinking of placing the tap on the left boundary wall near the sliding doors of the house. For the house bricks noted about needing frost proof bricks. I know exactly where the drain is thankfully.
How I am proceeding is the architect is project managing the extension build. He had asked about the contractor doing the garden too but my issue is the architect gets 10% commission on all the work the contractor is doing. So I have decided to project manage the garden build myself to save the 10%. I have however included the boundary walls in the tender for the main building works the contractor will carry out.
I am glad you are helping me Lizzie. I was really a bit depressed when buying the house and having a concrete jungle on my left and middle aspects. But now things are starting to look up now that I can more clearly picture in my mind how things will look.
@Dannyboy334 , I'm pleased to help, I love doing garden design although I don't always get it right. I've done five of my own and a few for family and friends. My apologies, I'm amazed that the ivy fence is real, I couldn't see any pots underneath from the photo so I wonder how they plant them.
I think both the plants I mentioned would be fine in your garden, as terrace gardens are normally a bit warmer and more sheltered (the brick walls help to keep the heat in). The end wall should get enough sunshine and the middle planter should have some sunshine/light from the east and west sides. They may not flower as profusely as they could in more sunshine but I think you prefer a more foliage look anyway.
I was thinking the clematis will grow up your metal supports and then twine along your pergola (it might need some tying in perhaps). You could always plant the orange flowered Thunbergia one year in the trough as well to see if you like it.
Unfortunately I don't think 200mm is sufficient for another Trachelosperum. Once it gets going, it will climb across the top of the gateway and the left hand side. I would keep the wall/metal wires across the top of the gate purely for security purposes so thieves don't pinch your bike. You could either carry on with the wires across the top of the wooden fencing or raise the height of this to match the back wall.
Regarding the tree, I'm coming round to suggesting a multi-stemmed white birch which I think you can now get in a smaller version. This would look spectacular against your red brick wall and dark paving. It will require some work in sweeping up catkins, leaves and general debris occasionally but worth it.
I forgot about the sedums in the paving, they generally like hot, sunshiny places not shade but they are inexpensive so you could always try them and see what happens. I'm glad you thought about a tap, it makes watering so much easier. We've also got outdoor electric sockets which come in useful. One thing you did mention is the longlevity of plants, very few plants apart from trees live as long as 40-50 years so you should be prepared to replace them in time. You might well get bored of them in any case so it's a good chance to try something new.
By the way, I'm very impressed with your garden software plans - may I ask what programme you're using please? Think that's all for now.
@Dannyboy334, Thought you might like to see the plants in real life in my garden.
Clematis cirrhosa 'Freckles' in flower Nov 06 2018
Trachelosperum about 1.5 m up on fence. The red leaves are the dead ones they drop off in April/May so perfectly normal.
Same plant, somewhat burrowed under neighbours winter jasmine and my other plants in front. Combined, we have a 1.25 m wall plus just under 2 m fence on top. You can see how it is spreading along the fence on the right.
Clematis cirrhosa 'Freckles'. This had to be severely cut back when the new fence was erected this time last year, but it's already put on about a metre of growth sideways.
Same plant from the base, putting on lots of new growth right now, so I'm just cutting off stray bits with scissors. It's only got about 200mm of space so the roots must be spreading under the paving.
Posts
I would go for Version 4 - the moveable bench and if you mount it on locking castors, would be easier to move.
I do hope though you're costing this all out before you commit yourself - my guess is anywhere between £10-£20K, judging on my own garden landscaping project and that was 12 years ago. It's so easy to get carried away!
I guess my last remaining concerns are the planting arrangements. I want plants that will last at least 40-50 years and be low maintenance. For the planter coming out into the middle of the garden I was thinking of attaching a metal rusted look frame like the image below and attaching it to the beam of the pergola. What climbers would be best growing up this? I do like the look of the climber in the image below. In the image below how many years of growth are we talking to get to that state?
I had seen instant green fences from mobilane which would provide instant privacy. Please see the two images below. The second image shows the range they offer.
For the back wall I guess I have two options.
Option one of climbers growing up the wall and continuing up my extra metal wire frame. If I were to have climbers would they be able to stretch over to the left hand side of the wall to the left of the gate, so I get full wall coverage with only a soil bed to the right of the gate? Any climbers anyone could suggest.
Option two of evergreen privet trees meaning I would not need that metal wire on top of the brick wall. Could I have the trunks of the privet trees right up against that back wall and allow the crowns to over hang the 250mm thick back wall to give some extra breathing room for my main feature tree. If anyone feels I do not have enough space for the privet trees I could scale back the main patio by 300mm to allow for space.
For the squares where I have stones could I plant no maintenance succulent plants to add a bit of greenery?
The two boundary fences are 1800mm tall but the back wall is 2000mm tall to allow a gate to be fully enclosed. I wonder would I be better lowering that wall height to 1800mm to match the fences either side and just leave a gap at the top of the gate?
Any finally any ideas of what tree with a wide enough wide to fully stretch across the whole garden which is 4420mm wide.
Many thanks for everyones input.
I think the plant in the photo with the orange flowers is possibly Thunbergia alata and if so, it would have made that growth in one year as it is an annual plant. That means, it dies over the winter, you pull off the dead stuff and then buy new plants every year, so not low maintenance unfortunately.
I think you would be better off with an evergreen climber on the back wall such as a Trachelosperum asiatica or jasminoides, which grows slightly bigger to 9 m. Can be trained widthways. Both have small white/cream flowers in summer and I find mine very low maintenance. I just cut off wavy stems where I don't want them. Mine's got to about 3 m in about 4 or 4 years I think.
I believe the tree privets, although striking, would need too much maintenance as they grow quite quickly. We cut our privet hedge every 6-8 weeks throughout the summer and at that height, you would need a ladder and a hedge trimmer, either battery or electric.
Please don't get plastic ivy hedges - the ones I've seen are awful!
For the right angled centre planter, it occurs to me that you could site the base of this on good soil, which would give a climber sufficient room for roots and cut down on the watering, so less maintenance. Here I would go for an evergreen clematis like Clematis cirrhosa 'Freckles', which flowers over the winter with cream bell-shaped flowers with red freckles inside - a subtle match to the red brick. I find this quite vigorous and again low maintenance. The root system wouldn't be a problem.
If you had a solid bench with a hinged lid, you could keep your gardening tools/cushions in it.
A couple of extra points. An outside tap (if there's room on the house wall) would be an asset, as would electric wiring for outside lighting. This would need to be laid before the paving and you'd need a lighting specialist for this.
You mentioned reclaimed bricks for your walls. You cannot use old house bricks taken from inside the house for outside use as they are not frostproof and will surface flake and overtime will disintregate. So for your outside walls you will need to specify which ones you want. Although general builders are probably quite capable of outdoor constructions it is not a given that they will understand plant requirements for soil, water and space, so do bear this in mind.
One other important point is where your drains are and hopefully your solicitor should have a plan from the local water authority. In most old terrace houses, the drains and sewers are communal and usually run right along about half way down the gardens, parallel with the houses. There should be at least one drain cover in your garden which must not be paved over in case you need access to clear any blocked sewers (quite a common occurrence in a line of terraced houses - think disposable nappies/wipes etc!). The way round this is to cover the manhole with a metal purpose-built grid which then holds one of your paving slabs and which can then be lifted out if necessary. The alternative which many people use is just to put a big pot or trough over the original drain cover depending on where that is.
I'm still thinking about the tree so will come back later. Sorry it's such a long post but I'm enjoying this.
Just to let you know those instant hedges I linked to are real plants and not plastic, just in case you thought they were plastic.
I just looked up the Trachelospermum climber you suggested for the back wall. It states on the RHS website it supports south,west or east facing aspect but no mention of north facing. Do you think because it is at the back of the garden it should get some decent sunlight still as the house should not cast a shadow on that part of the garden due to how far back it is. You can see the images I posted earlier of a sun study of the back garden but please bare in in mind I will be adding a 2 metre single story extension out into the garden which is not shown in the sun study photos I previously took. Just to note the size of the garden I have shown on this thread takes into account the extension already having being built.
One extra thing I had thought about this climber is would things progress quicker if I grew it from both sides of the wall. Would a piece of soil jutting out 200mm from the small piece of wall on the left of the gate be enough space, this would still allow me to fit the bike in that part of the garden or else the bin and the bike at the opposite side.
For the right angled centre planter you mentioned Clematis cirrhosa as the climber, I just looked that one up on the RHS website and it does look beautiful. The only issue I can see is that it states it needs south facing or west facing sun. Will this pose a problem with my North facing garden?
I forgot to mention I will also need climbers for the pergola, are there any that you can suggest.
I was thinking of placing the tap on the left boundary wall near the sliding doors of the house. For the house bricks noted about needing frost proof bricks. I know exactly where the drain is thankfully.
How I am proceeding is the architect is project managing the extension build. He had asked about the contractor doing the garden too but my issue is the architect gets 10% commission on all the work the contractor is doing. So I have decided to project manage the garden build myself to save the 10%. I have however included the boundary walls in the tender for the main building works the contractor will carry out.
I am glad you are helping me Lizzie. I was really a bit depressed when buying the house and having a concrete jungle on my left and middle aspects. But now things are starting to look up now that I can more clearly picture in my mind how things will look.
My apologies, I'm amazed that the ivy fence is real, I couldn't see any pots underneath from the photo so I wonder how they plant them.
I think both the plants I mentioned would be fine in your garden, as terrace gardens are normally a bit warmer and more sheltered (the brick walls help to keep the heat in).
The end wall should get enough sunshine and the middle planter should have some sunshine/light from the east and west sides. They may not flower as profusely as they could in more sunshine but I think you prefer a more foliage look anyway.
I was thinking the clematis will grow up your metal supports and then twine along your pergola (it might need some tying in perhaps). You could always plant the orange flowered Thunbergia one year in the trough as well to see if you like it.
Unfortunately I don't think 200mm is sufficient for another Trachelosperum. Once it gets going, it will climb across the top of the gateway and the left hand side. I would keep the wall/metal wires across the top of the gate purely for security purposes so thieves don't pinch your bike. You could either carry on with the wires across the top of the wooden fencing or raise the height of this to match the back wall.
Regarding the tree, I'm coming round to suggesting a multi-stemmed white birch which I think you can now get in a smaller version. This would look spectacular against your red brick wall and dark paving. It will require some work in sweeping up catkins, leaves and general debris occasionally but worth it.
I forgot about the sedums in the paving, they generally like hot, sunshiny places not shade but they are inexpensive so you could always try them and see what happens. I'm glad you thought about a tap, it makes watering so much easier. We've also got outdoor electric sockets which come in useful.
One thing you did mention is the longlevity of plants, very few plants apart from trees live as long as 40-50 years so you should be prepared to replace them in time. You might well get bored of them in any case so it's a good chance to try something new.
By the way, I'm very impressed with your garden software plans - may I ask what programme you're using please? Think that's all for now.
@Dannyboy334, Thought you might like to see the plants in real life in my garden.
Trachelosperum about 1.5 m up on fence. The red leaves are the dead ones they drop off in April/May so perfectly normal.
Same plant, somewhat burrowed under neighbours winter jasmine and my other plants in front. Combined, we have a 1.25 m wall plus just under 2 m fence on top. You can see how it is spreading along the fence on the right.
Clematis cirrhosa 'Freckles'. This had to be severely cut back when the new fence was erected this time last year, but it's already put on about a metre of growth sideways.
Same plant from the base, putting on lots of new growth right now, so I'm just cutting off stray bits with scissors. It's only got about 200mm of space so the roots must be spreading under the paving.