Rose advice for an arch.

Alchemist · April 2019

Dear all, we just built a new patio over the Easter break and have put an arch in its entrance (photo attached) as we wanted some vertical interest. We are thinking of planting a climbing princess Margareta and Bathsheba on either side of the arch. Would it work? The other available options are: climbing iceberg, Madame julia correvon and etoile violet, mainly as we already have this or can be readily moved. The soil is clayey loam and it’s a south west facing garden. Any advice/ suggestion on combinations would be appreciated.

Alchemist · April 2019

Thanks @1Runnybeak1. Yes, pleased with the end result particularly as this corner was a dump with rubble buried from previous owners.

The rose on the right is crown princess margaretta. Ive not grown any of the roses mentioned here so not sure if these will be enough to fill out in 2 years time.

Hopefully someone who has grown these would be able to advice.

Alchemist · April 2019

Thanks @Hazel 1 have seen the previous threads and have learnt immensely from Marlorena and others in these posts. Mainly posting as unsure if the mentioned roses will be enough to cover the structure. Don’t want to find out after 2 years 🥺 as some of the climbers I have although is 2-3m, certainly won’t be able to cover this.

edhelka · April 2019

I would probably consider a thornless rose (or nearly thornless). How wide is it? It looks quite narrow, certainly narrower than standard arches (but maybe it is so tall or it is the angle). But if it is narrow and I imagine you want to weave the rose through the trelises and around them, I can see it snapping people easily.

Ffoxglove · April 2019

One thing I learned from Marlorena and experience is you probably don't want hybrid tea climbers because they are stiffer and impossible to twine through things.

E. g. I have compassion growing at my doorway and you definitely cannot bend the canes much at all. A repeat flowering rambler like Lady of the Lake might be good. Much more flexible and vigorous.

Marlorena · April 2019

Hello,... sorry to butt in late here, I don't always see threads unless they're in the Plant section...
..can I just say that's a lovely patio area, very nicely done indeed... you'll be spending some pleasant hours there I'm sure..

..just a word of advice if I may... I would not grow CPM and Bathsheba together, they are too similar, and can hardly tell them apart at times.. to get a classic rose arch look it's best to plant the same rose on both sides, so they join in the middle at the top.. it gives that coordinated look, rather than using 2 different ones.. even if similar..

..however, your arch does not look very wide to me... ideally it's best to be at least 4 foot width.. if you have 2 thorny roses either side of that you might be fighting your way through the thorns to the patio... I can't tell the width exactly, only you will know but if you are happy to plant a rose each side, do consider using the same variety, not 2 different ones...
...you could also use just 1 rose and a clematis the other side....

..personally I wouldn't plant CPM on your arch, but grow it in the shrub border, it wants to grow more as a shrub and needs training specific to arches, which will take a little longer.. it will get there but not that quick... entirely your choice... mine would be 'James Galway'... both sides or 1 side only.. it will be up there in almost one season and the scent is divine, it also repeats well and good health..

..best of luck with your choices, it's going to look great !...

Marlorena · April 2019

..oh I notice @edhelka also mentioned about the width of the arch.. do consider that... it does look narrow..

Alchemist · April 2019

edhelka and @Marlorena thanks both for your helpful comments. You are right, the arch is narrow @ 1 meter wide with the side trellis being 2 feet. A larger one, although would have been nice, at the time of purchase was afraid of making the space look dis-proportionate. Love James Galaway! I f I buy 2 more JG rose, I have to manufacture some place for 2 of my existing roses, which I can't think of at the moment

. Also in fear of being reprimanded, may I ask if 2 Bathsheba would work in this space in a reasonable length of time? I also thought they were low thorns/ low snapping type?

@Ffoxglove point taken about HT climbers. Thanks! I just assumed most climbers are more or less pliable to some extent. Love Lady of the lake too.

Oh just when I thought my choices were made ......

Marlorena · April 2019

..oh don't worry, I dither over roses all the time... Bathsheba has less thorns that CPM, that's why I have it... the canes are quite thin and very pliable, easy to train.. I can't say for sure about an arch, I have mine against a shed... I get the impression with it that it's better grown that way, or against a fence where it can be spread out... it's approaching 8 foot tall but I've had it less than 2 years... the scent is unusual and rather nice.. worth a go... even with that arch width, you could probably get away with 2 of these because of the low thorns... and pliability.. and it's not overly vigorous that it will swamp you...

Marlorena · April 2019

I've just noticed you already have a CPM in a pot there... to keep things simple why not just plant that one as you intended and get another for the other side … that way both will grow at the same rate... I've seen photos of it over an arch, so I'm sure it'll suit your purposes over time.. if it proves too much, then you could always take one out ..

Alchemist · April 2019

@Marlorena thanks for your helpful suggestions. Yes I have a CPM and also a Bathsheba planted this Feb as bare root along a fence in another part of the garden. Hence my original thought on using them. To pair them up, I can either buy another CPM or Bathsheba.

I will also have some walks around the garden to ponder over your JG pair suggestion/ possible alternative places for the CPM.

Rose advice for an arch.

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